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Author Topic: NEW ROLL DAMAGE FIX!
nibbio
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Member # 7579

posted 11-27-2000 04:17 PM     Profile for nibbio   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message   Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote
Try it out!
Ciao,
nibbio
http://web.tiscalinet.it/jobim/cfs2

This mod attempts to model flak damage in a more realistic way. In fact, one of the
most common complaints heard on the net about CFS2 is the fact that as soon as a flak
burst appears on the horizon, your aircraft is slightly damaged, the smallest hole appears on a wing, and your aircraft suddenly loses 90% of its roll ability.
After some thought, and the realization that this only happens with flak damage
(the likelyhood of roll damage due to machine guns or cannons is much more remote), I went
and studied the flak effects files.

What I found is that the range of flak damage goes from a minimum of 100 to a maximum of
225 (meters I suppose, since the effects files parameters appear to be consistently
in international system units), whereas the actual hit points are quite low.

The fact that even a light flak burst always damages an aircraft 100 meters (330 feet) away
seems rather unrealistic.

So I reduced the radius of the damage area to one third of the original value;
correspondingly I increased by a factor of 10 the hit points; basically I concentrated
10x the damage in an area 10x smaller, obtaining roughly the same explosive
energy of the original flak burst, but concentrated in a smaller area.

After some testing in missions and campaign I can say that, whereas aircraft (both AI
and human) are fatally hit by flak roughly at the same rate as before, it's very rare
to get roll damage; in fact, when you're hit, the damage is much worse (even if often
survivable) but the chances of being hit are much lower (like the real thing, by the
accounts we have all read).

In conclusion, you can expect to be hit by flak more rarely, but much more seriously.
The only price to pay is that you don't experience those nice blast waves as often as
before ;-)


Posts: 166 | From: Italy | Registered: Oct 2000  |  IP: Logged
Peter N
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posted 11-27-2000 04:52 PM     Profile for Peter N     Send New Private Message   Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote
If this fix works (and I have no doubt about Nebbies hexing capabilities) it's nothing short of a miracle!

Off to test I go!

/petern


Posts: 28 | From: Stockholm, Sweden | Registered: Jul 2000  |  IP: Logged
Essel
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posted 11-27-2000 04:54 PM     Profile for Essel   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message   Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote
nibbio, thanks a million!

Will try it tonight.

Essel


Posts: 34 | From: Montreal, Quebec | Registered: Nov 2000  |  IP: Logged
nibbio
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Member # 7579

posted 11-27-2000 05:14 PM     Profile for nibbio   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message   Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote
I'm very interested in your feedback, let me know if it improves things.
Like I wrote in the readme, I only had a couple of hours to test, but I found it a good work around.
BTW Peter, I ain't no hexer all the files I modify are actually text files! Anybody can do it!
Ciao,
nibbio

Posts: 166 | From: Italy | Registered: Oct 2000  |  IP: Logged
Essel
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posted 11-27-2000 05:24 PM     Profile for Essel   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message   Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote
Nibbio, yes anybody can do it, but so far you're the only one that has been experimenting seriously with it.
Actually, would it be possible to publish a (very) quick primer on your findings (var structure, particle system params)? I sure would be interested.
BTW, I verified the unpublished additionnal FF parameters in the aircraft.cfg file and they work.

I'll do a separate post on it.

Essel.


Posts: 34 | From: Montreal, Quebec | Registered: Nov 2000  |  IP: Logged
Vancouver
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Member # 6550

posted 11-27-2000 05:25 PM     Profile for Vancouver     Send New Private Message   Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote
nibbio,
Thanks for looking into this problem. However, I've experienced the lack of roll problem against enemy fighters as well, not just flak. While poking around in the parameters files, did you find any values that specify the amount and/or frequency of damage for ailerons?

Posts: 147 | From: Vancouver, BC, Canada | Registered: Sep 2000  |  IP: Logged
nibbio
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posted 11-27-2000 06:14 PM     Profile for nibbio   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message   Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote
Van I have experimented extensively in the past few weeks with the Zero A6M2 damage profile. I tried increasing the life points of ailerons and ailerons control cables, and I also tried removing those systems altogether, to no avail. I also tried increasing the life points of the wing structure, but no joy. I finally came to the conclusion that the type of roll damage we experiment is mainly due to "general" damage, it's not linked to a particular system. It probably occurs when many systems are slightly damaged.
In the case of mg and cannon damage, the damage itself is localized where the tracers hit. In the case of flak, if you happen to be in the damage "bubble", ALL your systems will be damaged, but slightly (low hit points of the flak burst).
So what I did was reducing the damage bubble (to 1/3 of the original radius, so 1/9 of the total volume) and compensate by increasing the hit points by a factor of 10 (you can do it easily by tweaking the relevant effects files).
Thus the very decreased probability of the infamous roll damage. With the tweak enabled, if flak hits you, you won't have to worry about roll damage but OTOH you will have to fly through some rather heavy flak to be hit.
Hope it was clear... it's late over here
Ciao,
nibbio

Posts: 166 | From: Italy | Registered: Oct 2000  |  IP: Logged
nibbio
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Member # 7579

posted 11-27-2000 06:27 PM     Profile for nibbio   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message   Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote
Essel I certainly will. Just let me get out the oilslick mod before the end of the week...
The fact is that explaining these things effectively is not easy for me. But I promise I will soon!
Ciao,
nibbio

Posts: 166 | From: Italy | Registered: Oct 2000  |  IP: Logged
Holliday
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posted 11-27-2000 06:36 PM     Profile for Holliday   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message   Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote
I just flew an air-to-ship mission in my current campain and I must say this is a big improvement. Make no mistake, you can take bad damage, and your roll rate will suffer, but you can stay on target a lot longer before it becomes a problem. Not to mention the huge volume of smoke and flame gushing out of each damaged ship (but that is another mod). Great stuff.
Posts: 139 | From: Wilmington NC USA | Registered: Feb 2000  |  IP: Logged
nibbio
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Member # 7579

posted 11-27-2000 06:44 PM     Profile for nibbio   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message   Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote
Thx Holliday!
Ciao,
nibbio

Posts: 166 | From: Italy | Registered: Oct 2000  |  IP: Logged
Nimits
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posted 11-27-2000 09:19 PM     Profile for Nimits   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message   Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote
Sounds good. I will have to try it.
Posts: 127 | From: | Registered: Oct 2000  |  IP: Logged
Sartori23
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Member # 7596

posted 11-28-2000 12:05 AM     Profile for Sartori23   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message   Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote
Thank you!!!! It was so nice to fly a mission, see the 'flak hit your nose section' message and still be able to engage an enemy fighter.
Posts: 8 | From: Redlands, CA | Registered: Oct 2000  |  IP: Logged
SpinDry
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Member # 7379

posted 11-28-2000 06:32 AM     Profile for SpinDry   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message   Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote
I re-flew the "evict the neighbors" mission with your mods, and it was much improved. I actually did catch flak in a wingtip and lost some roll rate, but it was well-deserved because I got cocky and earned it. The flak is still very much a major threat, but now a seemingly more realistic one.

Thank you!


Posts: 296 | From: Rome, NY, USA | Registered: Oct 2000  |  IP: Logged
Barkhorn1x
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Member # 5615

posted 11-30-2000 07:41 AM     Profile for Barkhorn1x   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message   Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote
Nibbio:

Great work - I have not been nailed by flak since I put your files in place. I like your other mods as well.

Question, is there a way to limit the AMOUNT of flak? The heavy stuff just kills my framerate.

I know this would not be too historically accurate. But I am not simming to be nailed by flak anyway - just want some atmosphere.

Regards,
Barkhorn.


Posts: 63 | From: Davie, FL, USA | Registered: Jul 2000  |  IP: Logged
buz13
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Member # 546

posted 11-30-2000 09:17 AM     Profile for buz13   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message   Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote
Thanks-----seems to be working great. I did try the straffing training mission and take a direct flack hit that blew me out of the sky but I love not being disabled by distant or near misses.
Posts: 385 | From: Seattle, WA USA | Registered: Oct 1999  |  IP: Logged

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