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Author Topic: EECH,KA-52and GUNSHIP
Member # 4800

posted 06-12-2000 06:41 PM     Profile for ice705   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message   Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote
Best graphics= KA-52
Best models andgood graphics= Gunship
Best looking weapons effects=Gunship
worst of above EECH
EECH is way over rated.
I got the full version shipped to me friday
been playing all 3 games and unless they are planning a big patch for EECH I am totally unimpressed.It reminds me of Novelogics commanche without the ugly landscape.The ground is flat,the buildings,vehicles,ships any other thing you can see are unfinished.don't knock gunship and Ka52 they are the best helo simms out there today.Now that that's off my mind I think I'll fly KA-52 till it freezes up on me then around of GUNSHIP,then to top it off I'll do a few bombing runs with Falcon 4.0 the best of the best of Jet simms yet.Don't mean to offend anyone.Just calling them like I see them.

Posts: 131 | From: waltham,ma usa | Registered: May 2000  |  IP: Logged
Member # 4

posted 06-12-2000 07:21 PM     Profile for Bigshot   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message   Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote
So go tell somebody over on the Gunship Forum the good news!!! EECH = Falcon4. And I hate coconuts. Does anybody care that when I eat coconuts, I get really, really sick and puke all over the carpet.

The only thing FREE in this world is "LONG DISTANCE TELEPHONE CALLS" at HEHEHEHE

Posts: 1291 | From: Suttons Bay, MI, USA | Registered: Sep 1999  |  IP: Logged
Member # 1277

posted 06-12-2000 07:38 PM     Profile for Spawnbob   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message   Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote
The next post is a repeat of a post i did some time ago i hope it might answer some of your question about EECH being Unfinished or the Landscapes being flat.
By the way i have tried Ka-52 TA and Gunship and i try to see good in all games.
The thing that stood out in Gunship was the way the tanks move , with Ka-52 TA it seemed more Like EECH. Gunship has at times good graphics but they all the same, the same landscape , the same battles.
Ka-52 is far more resource hungry than EECH and is less stable.
The post below is not some glamour shot post that developers do but an honest opinion of EECH , it has very few faults and is very immersive, so give it a chance.
If u like Falcon4 than EECH is the closest thing to Falcon with rotors.

Sorry to all the people that have seen this post before , sorry to hammer down a point but for unconvinced people who are undecided on Ka52, Gunship or EECH i will use this.

Posts: 1341 | From: | Registered: Dec 1999  |  IP: Logged
Member # 1277

posted 06-12-2000 07:40 PM     Profile for Spawnbob   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message   Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote
Enemy Engaged : RAH-66 Comanche versus Ka-52 Hokum

Why all Sim Lovers whether it be Prop, Jet, Tanks or Helicopters should buy it

What is this post about, well considering the recent cancellations of many Flight sim products i thought it was prudent to advertise the existence of a New Helicopter Sim called Enemy Engaged : RAH-66 Comanche vs Ka-52 Hokum by Razorworks.
First i have no connection with Razorworks or Empire and this post has been cross posted on various related forums, message boards to inform why if you like sims you will like Comanche Hokum.
Hopefully some of you reading this will go and buy Comanche Hokum and help support Quality in the Flight Sim arena.

I have cross-posted this to a lot of forums, so please donít get annoyed if you see if more than once. But I want to let Flanker 2.0, Falcon 4, EAW players, Janes F18 know about this Sim.
I have also posted this on EECH forums just in case people who havenít got it yet but read the forums.
Why is this not on a Dedicated Web Site , it would save a lot of Duplication , i can be sure that EAW, Falcon4 fans would come to a EECH site so i have to go to them.

First I am a big Fan of Falon4, Longbow 2 and European Air War so I know what a quality Sim is , but im not adverse to a bit of Half-Life Team Fortress. So first things First who is Comanche Hokum aimed at , will it satisfy Falcon 4 Diehards and people new to the Flight Sim genre who do not want to be overwelmed by a sim's complexity. The answer is yes to both so lets see what it's all about.

Comanche Hokum is the sequel to the critically acclaimed but commercial failure Apache Havoc . Developed by a smallteam called Razorworks ( made of ex Digital Integration staff , Tornado, Hind etc ) and Published by Empire. Fundamentally Comanche Hokum is an extension to Apache Havoc and improves vastly on a very good product to make the definitive Helicopter sim of the 00's.

So what does Comanche have to offer.

  • 2 Flyable Helicopters ( US Comanche / Russian Hokum )
  • 3 Dynamic Campaigns ( Yemen, Taiwan, Lebanon )
  • Excellent Graphics
  • Fantastic Attention to Detail
  • Dynamic Weather System
  • Quoted as one of the Best / most Realistic Flight Models for Helicopters ( im not a Helicopter pilot , so i have to take their word ), with various options to increase Flight Model complexity.
  • The best Virtual 3D Cockpits ever seen, with working Multi Function Displays.
  • The best viewing system ever devised
  • Easy to Use and Effective Padlock
  • Terrain Masking and Line of Sight
  • No Loading between action
  • Intelligent Wingman and Friendly Forces.
  • Fantastic Varity of Units ( Air, Ground , Naval )
  • Incredible Stability
  • Mini Campaigns ( Skirmishes )
  • Seamless Integration with predecessor Apache Havoc to add 3 more campaigns and 2 more Helicopters
  • Great Multiplayer Action

Lets go into each one of these more closely.

2 Flyable Helicopters
With Comanche Hokum you can play either side in a battle (US or Russian ), enabling you to fly the different helicopters, with Apache Havoc installed you get to fly the Apache and Havoc as well, each Aircraft is unique with it's own performance, weapons, radars etc.

3 Dynamic Campaigns
which can be played from either side ( note with Apache Havoc this amounts to 6 Campaigns , Cuba, Thailand, Caspian Sea, Yemen, Taiwan, Lebanon )
In each campaign you have set objectives to reach say occupy certain military bases, airbases etc . These change each time you start a new campaign. The campaigns follow the Day/Night cycle and are continous, i.e the action is always going on even if youíre not flying.
Tanks will battle it out with each other, Helicopters will go on Troop Insertion missions, F16 will fly Combat Air Patrols.

The world has a limited amount of units, so no flying against an infinite Airforce, their side and your side will get resupplyed but not by some invisible mechanics but by C17 Globemasters and Chinocks and Hip helicopters which if you see and shoot down then those supplies donít get delivered.
On your map screen you will see the battle unfold and via Radio communications you will hear the calls for Close Air Support which are genuine and can be located on the map.

As the war progresses the Front line will move back and forth as you can and they can capture installation such as Airbase's , FARPS, Factories , these in turn will be used for you side. Again this is not achieved behind the scenes. Take out an Airbase and a BDA ( Battle Damage Assessment ) Flight's will be generated which either the computer or you can fly, depending on this intelligence , a further strike might be prepared or a Troop Insertion .
For the troop insertion you can fly escort to the BlackHawk, and if they capture the installation ( which is determined by the amount of damage you done, the more likely your ground troops will succeed ) further Repair and Supply missions will be tasked to that Airbase. Finally Transfer missions, which will transfer Helicopters, Airplanes to the New operational Airbase and can be used as a base of operations.
Remember the enemy will be doing the same thing to you and should any link in the chain be broken , i.e. your troop carrying blackhawk gets shot down then the whole process will be delayed.

All-important events in the campaign will be relayed to u and kept in the Log section, also u will see areas of engagement on the map as they happen. At all times u can see the levels of opposing forces types.

The main Campaign Screen showing the Balance of Power

Any friendly unit can be click on in the Map and A Live feed is shown

The log shows all the recent action, by clicking on a message, the 3D Window shows u the action and the MAP goes to its location. The list on the right shows the OOB(Order of Battle) every friendly unit, bases, Installation

An Installation that needs to be protected

The Graphics in Comanche Hokum are excellent, Clean , well defined and varied. Not Photorealistic like Falcon4 but offering terrains, from the lowlands with fields, to high Snowy Peaks and massive Towns with unique buildings that have excellent damage modelling. The planes and units look gorgeous with fantastic lighting effects. support for T&L on geoforce. upto 1600*1200 resolution.

One of the Campaign's Theatres ( Yemen ) , Each has it's own unique Terrain

Attention to Detail
The attention to detail is outstanding, from the tank commanders opening his tanks hatch and looking out and firing his mounted Machine Gun, to the moving windscreen wipers that can be seen on the helicopters, the Hercules lower their cargo ramp and eject multiple supplies by parachute to the Bases down below. To the Helicopter carriers with incredible detail with Helicopters taking off and landing. Watch MRLS pound bases with their rockets and even fly with the rocket.

Small Part of Beirut, which house many unique buildings, ranging from Huts, Mosques, Shops, Office Blocks and Ports

Dynamic Weather
The Dynamic Weather system enables you to fly into different weather systems or for them to move to you, so one minute is a nice sunny day then you fly into a mild shower then it becomes a dark sky with torrential rain and lighting. Also as you fly the campaign you will witness spectacular Sunset's and Sunrises, which darken, lighten the sky as appropriate.
Also things like variable wind make much more of an impact than in a jet going 500mph.

Flight Model
The flight model has several options to increase/decrease difficulty they are blade stall, ground effect, over toque, vortex ring, wind. Plus Hover mode, Altitude Hold and Stable Hover mode, plus autopilot.
Weight and Altitude are taken into consideration so you require more power to take off fully loaded from a mountain then at sea level. The wind will buffet your helicopter and really affect your control. Taxing is possible and even rolling takeoffs.

3D Cockpits
The 3D Cockpits are simply gorgeous, panning is simple and quick and you can choose who to fly from ( pilot, co-pilot ) with unique MFD settings for each, swapping between the two is a matter of pressing the ESC key.
All the Displays are updated and can even be seen from external views, updating perfectly. Even the Glasses mounted on the helmets show the HUD from the various views ( which is displayed on the Glasses , so when you turn you head you will always see the HUD).

Viewing system
The viewing system really deserves some praise as it's the most flexible and powerful out there. First there is all the usual Chase Cam, fly by, action camera etc. But what makes this stand out is the ease you can view any unit on the battlefield.
Integral is the Filter set-up (F12) which enables you to filter the units, by side, type, subtype and individual unit. So you can set up a filter with ease that only shows
Allied Transport Aircraft, Chinock's, or Enemy Infantry with SAMS. Using the hotkeys you can quickly dart about finding the action from any position. Also you can quickly cycle thru the flyable helicopters, didnít I say you can jump into any flyable helicopter ( Comanches , Apaches, Hokumís, Havoc's , dependant on AH installed and Side ) by viewing the unit and pressing U.
Also you can select a friendly unit on the map and go straight to viewing it. The unit will appear in a small 3D window which can be panned/zoomed or you can press for Full screen action.

A View of the Duel Cockpit of the Hokum , the pilots faces can be edited with your own

By pressing the number keys 1 to 5 you get a quick padlock to nearly anything you want, be it Waypoints, Target , Wingmen, Threat (SAM, AA Missile ) etc.
It's all done with one view , (no 2D cockpit ) so it's seamless as you heads just turns to look in the right Direction.

Terrain Masking / Line of Sight
Comanche Hokum features proper Terrain Masking, so it pays to keep low and out of sight to avoid those missiles. Also is line of Sight, which means that if a building is between you and the tank and you can't directly see it then you cant get a lock.

A view of a Small Town in Cuba thru the Hokumís periscope

No Loading
The Main Campaign screen can be accessed at any time by pressing ENTER and when you die , complete a mission ,want to get into a new Helicopter there is no loading between mission's just selected the new flight and your in , no 5 minute waits to load it in.

Your wingman will vary with type and number and might be Apaches, Blackhawks or Hindís. If you are the flight leader or a wingman determines what you can do with them, they will attack, do BOBUPís, hold position, attack targets of opportunity and take the missile for you. Also friendly units will help you, you can call for assistance, in the Form of Airstikes, Artillery, and Air Intercept Assistance, when you call for these if the resources are available the sorties will be generated and vectored to you.
In the case of Air Assistance any friendly air units capable of helping you will come, and ive done this and it works unlike many Sims where it's doesnít. The 2 most recent occasions I had trouble with some Su25's I called for assistance and some F16's nearby came and helped me out. The other time I was attacking a major airbases I called for help, 4 A10's turned up and attacked all the Samís and Armour. I knew it was the ones I called for as they responded (x) unit coming to assist and it was the unit that turned up and this was not their intended target and you can see all the missions for every unit so they diverted just for me, which afterwards they resumed their mission.

Multiple Wingmen who follow your Orders and can act independently

Fantastic Varity of Units ( Air, Ground , Naval )
The world of Comanche Hokum is detailed and varied, from T80 Main Battle Tanks, to Harriers and A10's. Infantry who patrol bases and Armoured Personal Carriers, SA19's, Ural Fuel Trucks. Sea Cobras, Stallions, Hip and Hook helicopters. Landing Craft, Destroyers and Helicopter Carriers the battle is intense and varied.

A Rocket Attack in the Night , the Rocket can be Followed and the Damage it does

Incredible Stability
The Release version is stable , fast and features NO real bugs. Even though the game already has a patch but this features minor issues as CH works and doesnít need any fixing.

Along with the main campaigns there are numerous mini campaigns, which have limited objectives and units. According to residential Helicopters expert Richard 'Flexman ' Hawley these can easily be edited and an editor might be made allowing custom skirmishes. Razorworks have already released over the net additional skirmishes.

Integration with Apache Havoc
If you have Apache Havoc ( CH's predecessors ) then this integrates with Comanche Hokum to include 3 more campaigns ( 6 total ) and 2 more flyable helicopters ( 4 total ) the integration is seamless and Apache Havoc can be found on budget so there is no reason not to get it. The cockpits have been slightly updated for The Apache Havoc helicopters so multiple resolution support is better but the Virtual cockpits are not as good ( still good though). Of course all the benefits of Comanche Hokum are present and you do not need the AH CD once installed.

Great Multiplayer Action
Multiplayer in CH is seamless, and stable. So u enter the IP number and join a game. The games could be running for days and there is dedicated server support. Basically u pick your side and you fight a war with other human pilots. they can be your wingmen or do there own thing. the war wages on around you. When u want u can save the campaign and continue in another session.You can continue a Single player campaign and have People join it , or have a Multiplayer campaign and finish it off in Single player. CH makes no distinction between online and offline so it's all transparent. The ability to pick Helicopters in flight means there is no waiting around for missions.You can share targets list with other Humans and the Campaign Map serves as a great AWACS, JSTARS platform. Plus you can have humans on either side going against each other.

Multiplayer Action

So to sum it up if your a Flight sim fan , whether Hard Core or not, Airplanes or Helicopters Comanche Hokum has something to offer all of you.
This is by far the longest post I have ever done and posted to the most sites.
I feel that with the slump in Flight Sim development we should support the Developers that bring us Quality Software and Comanche Hokum does what it says on the box and more.
So next time u buy a game take a long look at Enemy Engaged : Comanche vs. Hokum as it deserves to have Financial success , again I have no links with any of the developers, publishers, sites but I love flight Sims and I can recommend this one with out a doubt.

Here are some links.

Dedicated Sites and Forums

thanks to Sean tudor for a lot of these links.
Thanks to the many Beta testers of CH who provide their expertise on the many forums.
And thanks to all the people with EH sites and who have posted such great posts on the various forums.

Note Comanche Hokum is not officially released in the US of this moment, it will be released approx June / July up to the latest patch level at that time.
However on the forums and sites mentioned you will find various companies that import CH for a reasonable price. The US version will be fully compatible with Worldwide CH and Vice versa.

Note all Screens shots where done on a Voodoo 1 card at 640*480 Resolution.
All images are at 65% JPG compression.
JPG compression in some pictures causes colours to appear Blotchy this isnít the case in the Game just the Result of Image Compression.
The formatting of this post is not cetain and could be highly dependant on the resolution of your screen and font size.

Thanks to the sites that hosted this post and sorry for Duplicating across boards but i feel Quality Sims need exposure, thanks for reading this and sorry for any spelling . links mistakes.

David Renton aka "Spawnbob"
Email : [email protected]

Posts: 1341 | From: | Registered: Dec 1999  |  IP: Logged
Member # 3472

posted 06-12-2000 11:01 PM     Profile for '   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message   Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote
That post was a nuke, in every aspect.

... --- ... --- ... --- ...

Posts: 445 | From: Canada | Registered: Mar 2000  |  IP: Logged
Member # 4851

posted 06-13-2000 04:03 AM     Profile for SpinDoctor   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message   Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote
The graphics don't make a game...

`nuff said

Posts: 33 | From: Sweden | Registered: May 2000  |  IP: Logged
Member # 4800

posted 06-13-2000 05:09 AM     Profile for ice705   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message   Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote

Posts: 131 | From: waltham,ma usa | Registered: May 2000  |  IP: Logged

posted 06-14-2000 08:25 AM       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote
Ice705> I dont know what your talking about,
Gunship certainly looks good no doubt, that does'nt make up for the horrible game (I say GAME as in ARCADE) the lack of control I have when flying (switching to the outside view..the pilot takes control..WHAT>>???)
And dont get me started on the flight model.
I hav'nt played EECH yet but from what people are saying it sounds like its the F4 of helo's so far. You seriously need to play a real sim before declaring Gunship the king of the hill, of course I respect your opinion!
But I have played just about every flight game thats come out since C64!
I know a sim vs an arcade game when I play one heh

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Member # 4800

posted 06-14-2000 03:10 PM     Profile for ice705   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message   Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote
I agree gunship is flawed bigtime.And I agree
KA-52 is resource hungry.I was just expecting alot more with all the hype about EECH.I'm running on P2400,128 megs of ram V3/3000 had to drop screen res to 256 1200x1600 to get good graphics andd smooth out the choppiness,plus when I found the accelerated timectrl+= it ran even better.
not out to offend anyone all your oppinions are highly appreciated.instead of getting upset people should just suggest how to improve what i;m complaining about.gameplay is another story,eech is definately got that area coverd just didnt mention that.sorry

Posts: 131 | From: waltham,ma usa | Registered: May 2000  |  IP: Logged
Member # 291

posted 06-14-2000 08:18 PM     Profile for INSPECTOR   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message   Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote
i would simply add that razorworks (eech) is the only publisher of the three to show a commitment to the game by developing regular patches (two out so far, a third beta patch is circulating now). with each patch this sterling game gets even better .....

for any undecided, i would recommend buying eech, - and to those just starting eech, i would suggest: utilize all patches and utilities for it, practice it, then make a final decision.

Posts: 109 | From: omaha, ne | Registered: Sep 1999  |  IP: Logged
Member # 5101

posted 06-14-2000 08:21 PM     Profile for holbrop   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message   Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote
If EECH is any cooler than KA52-TA I'm scared I'll wet my pants if I play it. Maybe when I get my upgrade to the AMD 550 I'll pick it up and slip into a diaper.

Happy Hunting,

Posts: 201 | From: North Carolina | Registered: Jun 2000  |  IP: Logged

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