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Author Topic: The "Crazy Cuban" Maneuver
THX-1138
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posted 01-31-2000 09:27 AM     Profile for THX-1138   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message   Edit/Delete Post
Does anyone know what the "Crazy Cuban" maneuver is? I remember seeing it either on EF2000 or EAW flight manual but I don't have those sims anymore. Any help is appreciated.

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"You can get much farther with a kind word and a gun than you can with a kind word alone."

-Al Capone


Posts: 220 | From: Miami, Florida - USA | Registered: Jan 2000  |  IP: Logged
CFrancisco
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posted 01-31-2000 09:45 AM     Profile for CFrancisco   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message   Edit/Delete Post
HHMMM .. not really sure but wasnt it a Dive bomber technique of Lobing the bomb up and over unto the target? Please correct me if i am wrong as its been awhile, i remember this being mentioned to me back when i was playing PAW and i think i kept trying to perfect it but i kept arriving at the same point as the blast area ..HAHAHA aaahhh swimming in the warm pacific ocean...

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Obersleutnant K. von Hess
I/JG52 Gruppen Kommandeur

quote:
God is not on the side of the big battalions, but on the side of those who shoot best.
Voltaire (1694-1778)

Posts: 4364 | From: NYC, NY | Registered: Sep 1999  |  IP: Logged
Saburo_O
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posted 01-31-2000 02:58 PM     Profile for Saburo_O   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message   Edit/Delete Post
EAW manual P. 203 has the Cuban 8, I think that's what you're referring to.
Posts: 88 | From: Champaign IL | Registered: Jan 2000  |  IP: Logged
THX-1138
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posted 01-31-2000 03:25 PM     Profile for THX-1138   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message   Edit/Delete Post
Thanks, I thought it was more like a bomb dive technique but maybe you are right Saburo_O.

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"You can get much farther with a kind word and a gun than you can with a kind word alone."

-Al Capone


Posts: 220 | From: Miami, Florida - USA | Registered: Jan 2000  |  IP: Logged
GunFodder
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posted 02-01-2000 05:49 AM     Profile for GunFodder   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message   Edit/Delete Post
FWIW Dept:There was also something called a "Crazy Ivan," but I believe that was submarine related....
Posts: 84 | From: Maryland, USA | Registered: Jan 2000  |  IP: Logged
Edwin Rommel
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posted 02-01-2000 05:57 AM     Profile for Edwin Rommel   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message   Edit/Delete Post
Herren

Zhere ist also somevhot called a "Dumb Blonde"- Zhis ist ein fallacy

E.R.


Posts: 4399 | From: Dusty Oasis, Nord Afrika | Registered: Sep 1999  |  IP: Logged
Majesty5
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posted 02-01-2000 08:55 PM     Profile for Majesty5   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message   Edit/Delete Post
"Crazy Ivan" was a radical change in speed and direction that Soviet subs used. If I remember right, I can say that the USS Lapon, commanded by "Whitey" Mack, was the first to encounter this when he was trailing a new Soviet missile boat on it's first patrol. It might have been a Yankee, not sure.

I could be wrong, but I just finished "Blind Man's Bluff" last week, so it's still fresh in my head.

I thought the "Crazy Cuban" was a maneuver used to lob nuclear bombs from fighters back in the Cold War days?


Posts: 789 | From: Dallas, TX, USA | Registered: Oct 1999  |  IP: Logged
CornFlake
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posted 02-02-2000 05:37 AM     Profile for CornFlake   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message   Edit/Delete Post
The Crazy Ivan maneuver is, as you say, a radical change of direction and speed to allow the sub to use the detection systems directed to his rear (its 6), as the sub could not use before beacause the engine and helix produced distorsions in the eco. These maneuvers are made without an apparent reason to do them, and this inexactitude is what makes dangerous to follow the russian subs.
See Tom Clancy's book "The hunt of the Red October"

_____________________________
Vista, suerte y... ¡al toro!


Posts: 95 | From: Barcelona. Spain | Registered: Dec 1999  |  IP: Logged
KMHPaladin
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posted 02-02-2000 06:32 AM     Profile for KMHPaladin   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message   Edit/Delete Post
I believe the Cuban 8 was a maneuver used to loft high-yield bombs (i.e. nukes) so that the pilot would have some sort of chance of surviving the blast... but don't quote me on that.

Anyone's who's seen the movie Hunt for Red October will remember Jonesy shouting "Conn, sonar, Crazy Ivan!" The Crazy Ivan was a maneuver used by Soviets in order to clear their "baffles," or the area behind their screw that their sonars cannot cover (although a towed-array sonar should to some extent help with this problem, to the best of my recollection many Soviet classes are not fitted with one.) It was called a "Crazy Ivan" because, as Cornflake said, they were radical turns meant to quickly bring their sonars to bear before the Americans could slow down. American captains (such as Whitey Mack) would be forced to follow extremely closely (resulting in a number of collisions over the years) and attempt to follow the Soviet around in his turn.

Did you like "Blind Man's Bluff" Majesty? I enjoyed it greatly. There was a program on PBS or TLC of some channel of that nature that talked about submarine espionage; both the man and woman who coauthored the book were interviewed. Whitey Mack was interviewed, and said that when he was following the Soviet sub for more than a month, he never got more than 4 hours of sleep - the exact time between Crazy-Ivan maneuvers for the Russian boomer.

Have a good one folks,

- KMHPaladin

[This message has been edited by KMHPaladin (edited 02-02-2000).]


Posts: 794 | From: RPI - Troy, NY; originally from South Jersey | Registered: Sep 1999  |  IP: Logged
Majesty5
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posted 02-02-2000 11:37 PM     Profile for Majesty5   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message   Edit/Delete Post
Oh man, Blind Man's Bluff was great. You know, I've read every TC novel except the last one. Or maybe two, I'm not sure... "Red Storm Rising" was my favorite book for about four years running, to the point where I practically had it memorized. (For example, I made it a point to insist that my family and I go visit Alfeld on the Leine in Germany in 1994. )

The same for HFRO, the first book like that I read, and I loved it. I always had a feeling that there was a lot more to submarining than even the novels hinted at, but man, I had no idea... What was it, nine collisions, at least? I think? Divers on the bottom of Okhotsk putting in cable taps... Man. I would have liked a bit more of on-the-ship type stories in there, more like novels of course, but it was still great.

What's cool is that I was finishing up the book in the car on the way to the Dallas Museum of Art. I got in there and walked around, and in one room they have an Installation Art by a guy named Chris Burden. He made a generic model of a submarine, and then hung one model for each boat that's ever been in US service from the cieling, so it was like a big school of fish that stretched from the floor to the cieling. On the back wall was a big list with the number and name of every sub in some kind of order, and in the opposite corner is a book that has each sub by number, and it gives commissioning date, CO, and a couple of sentences about the ship. I went through to "Halibut", "Lapon", and a couple of other names, and I don't think he's read the book. Or if he has, he just put in the "official" version of events.


Posts: 789 | From: Dallas, TX, USA | Registered: Oct 1999  |  IP: Logged

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