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Author Topic: Realism settings- what sez you?
Edwin Rommel
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Member # 357

posted 10-06-1999 01:02 AM     Profile for Edwin Rommel   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message   Edit/Delete Post
Mein Herren

Ich notice zat most of ze fliegers zay zat zey play wiv all "maxed out"- I would like to hear from ze "real" pilots out there- What settings do you recommend? Is some of the settings "over"modelled to compensate for Major Lee's "Sitting in a comfy chair, looking at a small screen"?- I ask this because IMHO things like:
1. Full torque effect without been able to trim sucks, surely you don't have to fight the AC all the time?
2. The black-out/red out effect, I recall reading on some forum a while ago that these effects are exagerated, even for the very high G's generated in the "flaming arse" AC (Local description of jet propelled AC), and even with no G-suits, would the effect have been as drastic in the airframe constraints of the WW2 AC.

I agree with having structural limitations, realistic gunnery, limited ammo and somesuch at "full", but the rest?-
What sez you?

E.R.


[This message has been edited by Edwin Rommel (edited 10-06-1999).]

[This message has been edited by Edwin Rommel (edited 10-06-1999).]


Posts: 4399 | From: Dusty Oasis, Nord Afrika | Registered: Sep 1999  |  IP: Logged
Victor
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posted 10-06-1999 03:08 AM     Profile for Victor   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message   Edit/Delete Post
I have all settings set to the highest realism; except for spins and stalls. I suppose that's cheating but with them on I find myself in spins far too often. And for me anyway; it's not that easy to always get out of those spins. Would be cool if there was a cheat key like in Mig Alley. This way if you failed to get out of the spin on your own; you could use it as a last resort. Better than having to re-fly that mission 5 times.

Oh yeah; I don't have the enemy pilots set to the highest AI either. They're just average like me


Posts: 236 | From: New York, NY | Registered: Sep 1999  |  IP: Logged
Kurt Plummer
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posted 10-06-1999 03:59 AM     Profile for Kurt Plummer   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message   Edit/Delete Post
Victor,

Be triumphant like your name and tweak up the AI. Believe me, it _won't make a bit of difference_.

And then you can proudly say "Hell no, I'm not 'average'!"

Honestly, never get suckered by a word like 'ACE' or 'Expert'. It's only a word and without better section and formation tactics and indeed the /willingness to fire/; these guys are NOT 'expert'.


KP


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TonyH
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Member # 110

posted 10-06-1999 04:25 AM     Profile for TonyH   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message   Edit/Delete Post
Hey, Edwin. Turn everything up except for Torque. And turn off padlock. Use the numberpad or mouse to look for the enemy. Thats the only way you will lose sight of em once in a while and don't use the magic back view, except on planes that had it in real life. Thats as far as the realism can go. IMO

Tony


Posts: 287 | From: Dublin, Ireland | Registered: Sep 1999  |  IP: Logged
KK
unregistered

posted 10-06-1999 05:02 AM       Edit/Delete Post
100% agree...

Settings: ON (except Torque and/or Engine OH)
Dificulty level: VETERAN
Campaign level: HARD
paddlock: OFF


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Twitch
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posted 10-06-1999 10:03 AM     Profile for Twitch   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message   Edit/Delete Post
For my 2¢- settings:
I always do a long career. I ususally do hard career, but find the lack of quaility squadron mates sucks too much. Also you almost never get help of extra fighters from ground control even with extra squads in .ini. I leave the HUD on though it's too hard to read as hi res. Since we have no feel like a real plane I rationalize that seeing the speed #s go yellow is the buffet I'd feel in the plane going toward stall, though I don't always see it while concentrating on the enemy. I don't use padlock. I toggle range on and off since we have no range-finding gunsight like real planes. I have all difficulties like torque, wind, etc. on. I mostly toggle off the dash since for me it is too much of a disadvantage compared to real vision where we have peripheral vision to really see. Even with snap views we are basically seeing WWII through a CRT less than 1/2 the size of a real fighter's front windscreen alone! And no matter what res we set the screen to it is not at all like focusing your eye and seeing any 3 dimensional object at any distance. Especially at long ranges in the air for real you can pick up things that you can't via the pixels on the screen. That's my rationale anyhow.

Posts: 638 | From: L.A. CA U.S.A. | Registered: Sep 1999  |  IP: Logged
Opa
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Member # 125

posted 10-06-1999 10:52 AM     Profile for Opa   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message   Edit/Delete Post
All settings to max, INCLUDING torque, engine OH. HUD=OFF(I have FF, so I can feel the stall coming), ASL, IAS. No back view. NO EXTERNAL VIEW! No padlock(I use the hat button). No reflies. Forgot the first time: Cockpit ON ALWAYS.

Victor.
If I were you, I'd include spins&stalls, because handling and avoiding them will make you know your plane better. You will definately benefit from that. Same goes for the rest. I'm an Emil-pilot, so you may say I like fighting my AC a bit... (just an advice...)

------------------

Der Opa

[This message has been edited by Opa (edited 10-06-1999).]

[This message has been edited by Opa (edited 10-06-1999).]

[This message has been edited by Opa (edited 10-07-1999).]


Posts: 710 | From: Sandnes, Rogaland, Norway | Registered: Sep 1999  |  IP: Logged
Kraut
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Member # 513

posted 10-06-1999 11:47 AM     Profile for Kraut   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message   Edit/Delete Post
My settings are like Opa's, except I use padlock to find the closest enemy or friendly. I sure miss the stall buzzer like I have in WBs, AW2/3 or even CFS now.
FWIW,
Good Hunting!

Posts: 754 | From: Kitchener Ont. Can. | Registered: Oct 1999  |  IP: Logged
Pasha
unregistered

posted 10-06-1999 02:04 PM       Edit/Delete Post
=o)

Here's all my crap to compare stuff and such..

[GRAPHICS]
TestDrawPrimitive=1
DisplayDevice=1
PlaneDetail=2
TerrainDetail=2
CloudDetail=2
EffectsDetail=2
HorizonDistance=2
Shadow=1
ExternalStores=1
LensFlare=1
LightSourcing=1
VirtualCockpitGauge=1
CockpitShake=1
VirtualCockpitProp=1
3dCityTargets=0
Gamma Value=100
Width=1152
Height=864
Bpp=32

[EAW]
PlayIntro=0
PlayerPlane=5
PlayerNation=2
LastCampaign=3
PlayerPilotName=
PlayerRank=2
GameName=
ExtraSquads=3
BirdSeed=30


[DIFFICULTY]
SkillLevel=2
FlightModel=1
Landing=1
Stalls=1
Torque=1
Overheat=1
Blackout=1
StructrualLimit=1
Wind=1
RealisticGunnery=1
LimitedAmmo=1
MidAirCollision=1
PlayerDamage=1
DisplayUnit=2
DisplayHUD=0
IndicatedAirSpeed=1
PressureAltitude=1

[DISPLAY]
HudColor_Red_R=250
HudColor_Red_G=0
HudColor_Red_B=0
HudColor_Blue_R=0
HudColor_Blue_G=0
HudColor_Blue_B=250
HudColor_Green_R=64
HudColor_Green_G=255
HudColor_Green_B=64
HudColor_Yellow_R=255
HudColor_Yellow_G=255
HudColor_Yellow_B=0
HudColor_LtBlue_R=0
HudColor_LtBlue_G=250
HudColor_LtBlue_B=250
HudColor_Violet_R=128
HudColor_Violet_G=0
HudColor_Violet_B=250
HudColor_Orange_R=250
HudColor_Orange_G=128
HudColor_Orange_B=0
HudColor_Pink_R=250
HudColor_Pink_G=0
HudColor_Pink_B=250
HudColor_White_R=250
HudColor_White_G=250
HudColor_White_B=250
HudColor_DkGray_R=55
HudColor_DkGray_G=55
HudColor_DkGray_B=55
DisplayInfoSetting=231

[SOUND]
SoundQuality=1
SoundChannel=16
SoundDist=2
SoundVolume=61440
EngineVolume=61440
ExternalVolume=61440
MusicVolume=8192
SpeechVolume=24576
ReverseStereo=0
Subtitles=0

[CONTROLS]
Force Feedback=2
Force Feedback Gain=9900
Flight Sensitivity=1.160000
Camera Sensitivity=1.000000
Swap Mouse X=0
Swap Mouse Y=1
Windows Joystick=1
JoystickDeadZone=5

[CAMPAIGN]
CampaignDifficulty=1
CampaignLength=1
CampaignLimitAicraft=1
CampaignLimitSupply=1

[Media]
Video Playback=1

[NETOPTION]
Year=1
SkillLevel=2
MissionType=5
BattleSize=0
TimeOfDay=1
AI_PlaneUpdateRate=181
PlayerPlaneUpdateRate=27
ClockSyncRate=125

[Miscellaneous]
Debug Flags=0
Debug Path=H:\

[Remappable Keys]
FLIGHT CONTROL=Joystick
CAMERA CONTROL=Mouse
RUDDER CONTROL=Rudder
THROTTLE CONTROL=
FRONT VIEW=F1
RIGHT FRONT VIEW=ADD
RIGHT VIEW=SUBTRACT
RIGHT REAR VIEW=SHIFT EQUALS
LEFT FRONT VIEW=F7
LEFT VIEW=F6
LEFT REAR VIEW=F5
UP FRONT VIEW=SHIFT F1
UP RIGHT FRONT VIEW=SHIFT F2
UP RIGHT VIEW=SHIFT F3
UP RIGHT REAR VIEW=SHIFT F4
UP LEFT FRONT VIEW=SHIFT F7
UP LEFT VIEW=SHIFT F6
UP LEFT REAR VIEW=SHIFT F5
INSTRUMENT VIEW=CTRL F1
INSTRUMENT LABEL=ALT F1
SNAPVIEW FRONT=ALT T
SNAPVIEW RIGHT FRONT=ALT D
SNAPVIEW RIGHT=ALT R
SNAPVIEW RIGHT REAR=POV_hat_Right
SNAPVIEW LEFT FRONT=ALT F
SNAPVIEW LEFT=ALT O
SNAPVIEW LEFT REAR=POV_hat_Left
SNAPVIEW UP=POV_hat_Forward
SNAPVIEW REAR=NUMPAD2
SNAPVIEW INSTRUMENT=POV_hat_Back
VIRTUAL COCKPIT VIEW=F8
PADLOCK CURRENT TARGET=Joystick_Btn_2
PADLOCK CLOSEST TO CENTER=SHIFT T
COCKPIT ON/OFF=DECIMAL
CHASE VIEW=SHIFT F8
FLY-BY VIEW=CTRL F8
TRACK VIEW - NEXT PLANE=F9
TRACK VIEW - PREVIOUS PLANE=SHIFT F9
TARGET VIEW=F10
PLAYER-TO-TARGET VIEW=SHIFT F10
TARGET-TO-PLAYER VIEW=CTRL F10
BOMB VIEW=F11
PLAYER-TO-BOMB VIEW=SHIFT F11
BOMB-TO-PLAYER VIEW=CTRL F11
ACTION VIEW=F12
DOGFIGHT VIEW=SHIFT F12
FREE CAMERA VIEW=CTRL F12
ZOOM BUTTON=Mouse_Btn_1
ZOOM IN=F2
ZOOM OUT=F3
PAN CAMERA UP=SHIFT R
PAN CAMERA DOWN=EQUALS
PAN CAMERA RIGHT=J
PAN CAMERA LEFT=H
CAMERA RESET=Mouse_Btn_2
STICK BACK=DOWN
STICK FORWARD=UP
STICK RIGHT=RIGHT
STICK LEFT=LEFT
RUDDER RIGHT=COMMA
RUDDER LEFT=SLASH
RUDDER CENTER=PERIOD
RUDDER FULL RIGHT=SHIFT COMMA
RUDDER FULL LEFT=SHIFT SLASH
START ENGINE 1=SHIFT LBRACKET
START ENGINE 2=SHIFT RBRACKET
THROTTLE UP=W
THROTTLE DOWN=Q
THROTTLE 0=
THROTTLE 10%=
THROTTLE 20%=
THROTTLE 30%=
THROTTLE 40%=
THROTTLE 50%=
THROTTLE 60%=
THROTTLE 70%=
THROTTLE 80%=F4
THROTTLE 90%=
THROTTLE 100%=
THROTTLE ENGINE 1 UP=LBRACKET
THROTTLE ENGINE 2 UP=RBRACKET
THROTTLE ENGINE 1 DOWN=SEMICOLON
THROTTLE ENGINE 2 DOWN=APOSTROPHE
FLAPS UP=Joystick_Btn_7
FLAPS DOWN=Joystick_Btn_8
WHEEL BRAKES ON/OFF=B
LANDING GEARS UP/DOWN=G
COCKPIT LAMP ON/OFF=L
FIRE SELECTED GUNS=Joystick_Btn_1
SELECT NEXT GUNS=X
SELECT PREVIOUS GUNS=SHIFT S
SELECT ALL GUNS=D
SELECT MACHINEGUNS=S
SELECT CANNONS=C
DISPLAY SELECTED GUNS=CTRL S
FIRE SELECTED WEAPONS=Joystick_Btn_3
SELECT BOMBS=N
SELECT ROCKETS=V
RELEASE DROP TANKS=Z
TARGET NEXT ENEMY=Joystick_Btn_10
TARGET PREVIOUS ENEMY=Joystick_Btn_9
TARGET CLOSEST ENEMY=Joystick_Btn_4
TARGET NEXT FRIENDLY=Y
TARGET PREVIOUS FRIENDLY=SHIFT Y
TARGET CLOSEST FRIENDLY=Joystick_Btn_5
TARGET NEXT GROUND=E
TARGET PREVIOUS GROUND=SHIFT E
TARGET BEST GROUND=Joystick_Btn_6
TARGET CLOSEST RUNWAY=U
DESELECT TARGET=BACK
FLIGHT INFO DISPLAY ON/OFF=NUMPAD7
TARGET INFO DISPLAY ON/OFF=NUMPAD8
TARGET DIRECTOR DISPLAY ON/OFF=NUMPAD9
TARGET BOX DISPLAY ON/OFF=NUMPAD4
TARGET ID DISPLAY ON/OFF=NUMPAD5
TARGET RANGE DISPLAY ON/OFF=NUMPAD6
RADIO MODE=TAB
CHAT MODE=GRAVE
PILOT MAP=M
AUTOPILOT ON/OFF=A
WING LEVELER ON/OFF=SHIFT A
NEXT WAYPOINT=P
PREV WAYPOINT=SHIFT P
ACCELERATE TIME=PAGE_UP
NORMAL TIME=PAGE_DOWN
SKIP TO NEXT ENCOUNTER=ALT N
JUMP TO NEXT PLANE=ALT J
BAIL OUT=ALT B
PAUSE GAME=ALT P
SOUND ON/OFF=ALT S
QUIT GAME=ESCAPE
ScreenCapture=RMENU


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Tailspin
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posted 10-06-1999 03:43 PM     Profile for Tailspin   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message   Edit/Delete Post
I turn all difficulties on except blackouts. I think they are overdone. Don't use padlock, use the hud for airspeed indicator. Hey guys IMHO without stalls and engine overheat on its just too easy.
Posts: 1895 | From: Metropolis USA | Registered: Sep 1999  |  IP: Logged
Karnak
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Member # 139

posted 10-06-1999 05:27 PM     Profile for Karnak   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message   Edit/Delete Post
I fly with all settings on max and no HUD. The only graphic option I have turned off is Lense Flares.
I don't have FF but I have found that the buffeting is visible and audible enough already, I don't stall or spin much unless I am flying a Typhoon, P-51, P-47 or Bf 110 and then I recover pretty easily unless it is a flat spin in the 110. Flying with out the stalls and spins would take a lot of the fun out of it for me, I love getting my kite right up to itss performance edge, riding the razor, and not losing control. I aggree that black outs are over modeled, but WWII kites were quite capable of causing them, so I'd rather fly with over modeled black outs than without them.(properly modeled this should be one place that the 109 beats the Spit, R.R.S. Tuck (29 kill Spitfire/Hurricane ace) said in his book that the pilots feet where up higher in the 109 than in the Spit, consequently less blood went into the pilots lege in high G manoeuvre (he test flew a captured Emil)). As for torque, EAW has, in my opinion a very weak torque model. I have it turned on for the slim bit of increased realism that it offers. The ability to set trim would be nice for cruising, but once the fight starts and your revs and airspeed are all over the place it wouldn't be very useful. If you want to see a good torque model, try WarBirds. Select a Spitfire Mk XIV (I am a Spit fan, but this is the worst offender in WarBirds) start on the ground and go to WEP from a stand still. If you don't work at keeping the Spit on its wheels it'll probably roll over.
Here is a quote, having to do with the handling of the Mk XIV, from Flt. Lt. Don Healey who flew Spitfire Mk XIVs agaist Japan with No 17 Sqd.
"The Mk XIV was a hairy beast to fly, and took some getting used too. I personaly preferred the old Mk V from a flying standpoint, but you talk to someone like Pete Brothers and he swears by the Griffon engined Spitfire, whilst Jeffrey Quill reckoned the Mk VIII was the best of the lot.
We were fortunate enough to be based in Madura when we received our first Mk XIVs as the runway was 3000 yards long, and fully concreted. It had been an important base for RAF Liberator units bombing Burma and Malaya in 1944/45, and was ideally suited for a squadron coming to grips for the first time with the vicious torque swing of the Griffon engine.
We were told to open the throttle very slowly at the start of our take-off, with full opposite rudder applied ti off set the five-bladed prop, which was driven by the Griffon in the opposite direction of the Merlin - this took some getting used too! Even with full aileron, elevator and rudder, this brute of a fighter still took off slightly sideways! However, once you picked up fluing speed, and trimmed the rudder and elevator, this torque pull became bearable.
One aspect you always had to bear in mind with the Mk XIV that no flying surface trimming could allow for was its considerable weight - it tipped the scales at 8475 lbs when fueled and armed, which made it over 2000 lbs heavier than the Mk VIII. Therefore, extra height had to be allowed for when rolling and looping, as it tended to "wash out" when flown this way. "Ginger" Lacey graphically showed us all just how serious a problem this was when he attempted to do a loop from what he thought was an adequate startinh height over Madura one afternoon. At the bottom of the loop he cleared the ground by barely 4 feet, and upon recovering back at the field Lacey looked ten years older than when he took off. He immediately gathered us around and told us in no uncertain terms not to attempt a similar manoeuvre with anything less than a 4000-ft reading on the altimeter.
Most of our work-up time at Madura was spent preparing to launch from the Trumpeter as part of the occupation of Malaya. A dummy flight-deck had been painted on the long runway to assist us in working on the length of our launching runs, but despite our countless attepts at reducing the length of our take-offs, the best we could do was part company with the tarmac 100 yards beyond the white line which theoretically marked the bow of the carrier! After much head-scratching, and a few sleepless nights, a Navy batsman was sent down to Madura to advise us that we would have the benefit of a 16-knot wind over the deck, although our take-off runn was stillto be only 270 ft long.
Fortunately, we did not have to fly the aircraft aboard the small escort carrier in the first place, the Mk XIVs being craned onto the deck. Nevertheless, we still had to take-off from the vessel, and the deck was crammed full of Austers and Fairchilds, as well as our Spits. Once in the Straits of Malacca, our aircraft were aranged three-abreast V-formation as far astern as they could be pushed. Rather stupidly, it was decided that we should launch first one at a time, rater than the much mor nimble Army AOP machines, so a good third of the deck was covered astern with these machines!
Our groundcrews had trimmed the brake drums on the undercarriage until they were almost binding, and removed the wire "gate" from the throttle, which when combined allowed us to open the Griffon up to nearly full boost without the fighter running off down the deck. We had practised back at Madura in this configuration, and with the brake lever fully on, the throttle well open, the stick pulled back into the pit of your stomach and opposite rudder applied to offset the prop torque, you could actually get the aircraft to lift its tail off the ground and still remain stationary - but only for a matter of seconds! Once you felt the brakes slip you released the lever, banged the throttle through the gate and shot off doown the deck."

Posts: 461 | From: San Rafael, California, USA | Registered: Sep 1999  |  IP: Logged
Kraut
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Member # 513

posted 10-06-1999 05:38 PM     Profile for Kraut   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message   Edit/Delete Post
Pasha, what's the difference between pink & purple?
Scroll Down.


The grip!!!! Hehe!!!
FWIW,
Good Hunting!


Posts: 754 | From: Kitchener Ont. Can. | Registered: Oct 1999  |  IP: Logged
Victor
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Member # 249

posted 10-06-1999 08:31 PM     Profile for Victor   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message   Edit/Delete Post
OK..I might try turning on stalls someday; but be happy I have engine overheating turned on.

Speaking of which; are the AI airplanes effected by stalls and spins? I already know that they aren't effected by overheating engines.


Posts: 236 | From: New York, NY | Registered: Sep 1999  |  IP: Logged
Foster Zygote
unregistered

posted 10-06-1999 09:13 PM       Edit/Delete Post
I fly "maxed out" including torque on. True we can't conveniently trim for torque, but the torque in the game is rather UNDER done. In real life pilots had to be careful with throttle application so as not to flip the plane over on it's back (especially bad at low level) and we should have to apply HARD rudder on takeoff to keep the rollout straight. A good friend of mine was an airframe mechanic in Vietnam and remembers a young Vietnamese spad pilot coming out in his silk scarf and cologne to fly a mission. He taxied out to the runway, ran the throttle up and promptly flipped the thing over.
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Slapphead
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Member # 59

posted 10-07-1999 01:14 AM     Profile for Slapphead   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message   Edit/Delete Post
I have everything on ,because it is forcing me to pay attention to my flying tecnique,for most the time, at a great cost.....
But I`m finding it challenging,frustrating,rewarding,agravating,exilarating,and plenty more "ings"....

I have the little speed indicator in the left window on,as an invaluable reference/tool for help in trying learn to fly at the planes "edge"(when,on the rare occasions, I get a good turn in, ect).

I do use padlock a lot,I have it set up on one my Saiteck buttons,so that I can quickly orientate myself (back to normal views)...

Why cant they make it support 32 bit color,so as to make use of all the hot Graphic cards about?is it a major programming task for the developpers/hackers?

God this sim is great


Posts: 1148 | From: london/uk | Registered: Sep 1999  |  IP: Logged
Edwin Rommel
Member
Member # 357

posted 10-07-1999 06:18 AM     Profile for Edwin Rommel   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message   Edit/Delete Post
Mein Herren
Danke for ze great participation zo far- Here is what I summarize:

Torque: Still a bit open with only Herr TonyH zaying "No"- Ze ozzer Herren feel ve should live with it, und I hesitate on zis von- On ze ground for take-off- Ja- but in ze air- always creeping zis way or zat- surely zat klienes thing on ze rudder offset most of ze effect in ze air, nein?
Flight mode: What does zis setting do- ??
Landing-: Full -Ja, Ja It is zo much fun with ze smokin maschine und ze hydraulic failure und al zat nein!!
Stall: Scheiss- Full Zis ist a Hard vun to get used to, du only lift your bum for ze prezure equalization exercise, to relieve ze pressure at Angels 20 from ze bratwurst un Bier zat you had, and dere ze damn Flugzeug goes!!!! Herr Viktor says nein- I wish I could follow his advise!!
Overheat: Zis adds fun nein- even if ze AI ignores zis!!!
Blackout/Redout: Herr Tailspin says zis is overdone- I agree- maybe because I vant to!!
Structural limits: Ja
Wind: Ja, exept for ze case mentioned in "stalls" above !
Realistic gunnery and ammo: Of course- ve are not playing in ze arcade !!- Zis ist war!!
Same for mid-air krashundburn und plane damage (Ozerwise Schultzie has no vork, nein?!)
Units- Metric of course- zere ist no ozzer zistem zat makes sense !!!
HUD: On, Ozerwise ze screen/seat of ze pants (still slightly varm, nein!!) flying makes ze game zo damn difficult to take ze "fun-factor" out?!
For ze feeling of surprise at landing on ze boden vhen ze altimeter still shows 200m, definitely ASL, und TAS

I also come to ze conlusion zat Opa, Karnak, Pasha ist masochists, nein?

Herr Twitch, no cockpit, und vhere may I ask do you store ze c**k zhen?- Or are du practising to be ze angel??

Herr Kraut- are du having trouble vif ze joystick as well?- or vhat ist der pink und purple thing??

Danke!

E.R.
Ps. Ich vill keep on listenink !!!

[This message has been edited by Edwin Rommel (edited 10-07-1999).]


Posts: 4399 | From: Dusty Oasis, Nord Afrika | Registered: Sep 1999  |  IP: Logged
Foster Zygote
unregistered

posted 10-07-1999 06:40 AM       Edit/Delete Post
But remember Herr Rommel that in the real crates the pilot had to CONSTANTLY adjust trim settings with every change in airspeed, altitude, and throttle. It's still much easier in the game than real life. Bf109 pilots had to fly with constant rudder pressure as the plane couldn't be trimmed to fly "feet off". But I think it's much more important to fly with stall/spin turned on. Without it on one can simply yank back on the stick as far as it will go and get the tightest possible turn. But in reality one could rarely horse the stick around like that without serious consequences. The challenge is to turn the tightest possible turn without going into an accelerated stall. I leave the lower left HUD on because the airspeed turns yellow when the plane is at the edge of a stall. This gives me the warning that I would get from the stick in real life. After a while it becomes second nature, even with stalls on I rarely ever depart anymore.
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von_M
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Member # 181

posted 10-07-1999 07:29 AM     Profile for von_M   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message   Edit/Delete Post
Umm Pasha, under the [EAW] section you have something called "BirdSeed=30", can someone explain what thats for?
von Manstein

Posts: 459 | From: London, Ontario. Canada | Registered: Sep 1999  |  IP: Logged
Twitch
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Member # 75

posted 10-07-1999 09:53 AM     Profile for Twitch   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message   Edit/Delete Post
I agree torque is a bit underdone for snap the throttle on take offs. But the EAW beta had it over done for cruise flight. You had to correct all the time! They fixed that for the final release version. Pilots had no bad torque effects in flight only takeof/landing when throttle was opened too quickly on machines like the Corsair and P-47. They were aware of it and it was no big deal to them. Once the plane was trimmed there was little fooling with trim wheels- especially in combat. German ace Walter Schuck-206 victories- once described to me how Spits had to trim out with the nose so high at higher altitudes that they could not see the enemy at 12 o'clock slightly low!
Posts: 638 | From: L.A. CA U.S.A. | Registered: Sep 1999  |  IP: Logged
DerAdler
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Member # 439

posted 10-07-1999 10:24 AM     Profile for DerAdler   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message   Edit/Delete Post
I would add that some aircraft did require excessive trim changes with changes in speed or power setting, even while in combat, in order to keep the control forces manageable. The P-51D was one of the worst offenders in this regard. Most present-day accounts of flying this aircraft state that the controls are set in stone at high speeds, while very few WWII-era pilots complain of this problem. I believe most of the present-day pilots are failing to trim out the excessive control forces at high speeds.

DerAdler
DerAdler


Posts: 8 | From: Tennessee, USA | Registered: Sep 1999  |  IP: Logged
Opa
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posted 10-07-1999 01:21 PM     Profile for Opa   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message   Edit/Delete Post
Von Manstein
Birdseed forces geese to appear more frequently. I've never seen them, but I don't really care so much about them either. There is a small hint towards their existence in the manual, btw.


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Der Opa

[This message has been edited by Opa (edited 10-07-1999).]


Posts: 710 | From: Sandnes, Rogaland, Norway | Registered: Sep 1999  |  IP: Logged
Tailspin
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posted 10-07-1999 03:54 PM     Profile for Tailspin   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message   Edit/Delete Post
Herr Rommel...When I first started flying EAW, I was really freaked out by the stall/spins characteristics. He,he..I didn't pick Tailspin as a handle for nothing! Hang in there, you'll get the feel for it. Sure your kills will go down at first, but you'll learn which bandits to go after and which bandits you are not in postiion to chase. After a while it just comes more naturally.
Posts: 1895 | From: Metropolis USA | Registered: Sep 1999  |  IP: Logged
Edwin Rommel
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posted 10-08-1999 01:17 AM     Profile for Edwin Rommel   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message   Edit/Delete Post
Mein Herren

Vielen Dank for ze participation !

Herr Foster Zygote- Ich fully agree with ze "realism" sentiment, but I wonder deep down in my heart, vhere I am to shy to admit to ze veteran fliegers, if taking ze limitations of a computer environment into consideration, and since ze seat of ze pants is on a comfy chair (Major Lee ), if ve are not making zis whole thing more difficult than necessary, or "realistic"- It is ze great idea for ze masochists to play at that level, but ze rest of us? (do we need to achieve zis excellence before going to ze zone?).

Herr von M und Opa : I've set ze bird seed and now sit in ze little hide-out on ze side of ze small lake next to meiner fliegplatz with ze loaded Double 00 - notzink zo far, where do you find ze verdamte geese?

Der Adler und zer "cockpit-lose" Herr Tailspin- If you cannot set the trim, would it not also be "fair" to dampen the effects normally under partial control of the "trim" setting?

Herr Tailspin- Ach I fully agree with ze fun side of trying to remain in ze envelope, or realizing zat ze verdamte Me 110 G4 vill not, repeat not, be able to catch zat particular Ami bomber du zo much vanted to finish off- but does it need to be all zat hard?? (Is zis realistic??)

Danke- I keep on listening !!

E.R.


Posts: 4399 | From: Dusty Oasis, Nord Afrika | Registered: Sep 1999  |  IP: Logged
DerAdler
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posted 10-08-1999 08:22 AM     Profile for DerAdler   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message   Edit/Delete Post
Herr Rommel,

You have made some valid points. My biggest trim-related gripe with EAW is that I can't fly straight and level, in most aircraft, at high speed without some pressure on the elevators. I don't like the damn wing-leveler; it's a poor substitute for the ability to trim the aircraft for level flight. In my opinion, this behavior should not have been modeled without the trim necessary to alleviate it.

DerAdler


Posts: 8 | From: Tennessee, USA | Registered: Sep 1999  |  IP: Logged
KMHPaladin
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posted 10-08-1999 08:52 AM     Profile for KMHPaladin   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message   Edit/Delete Post
I agree with Der Adler - a trim feature would be very welcome. I can never get my airplane to fly perfectly straight and level.

At any rate, it seems that most of the people on this thread fly without the padlock. Why is that? In real life, a pilot's field of vision is not limited to looking to a certain point, and then snapping back to the front. He can scan all around, and when tracking on a bandit he can swivel his head to follow. It is difficult enough to get the feeling of sky around you when flying with a flat monitor, and in my opinion the SA and "immersion" is increased greatly by turning on padlock to track, because unlike in some sims the view won't go straight back. I like Super Hornet's padlock model better, where if the bandit flies out of a certain cone then you lose padlock, but EAW's is acceptable. That, of course, is my opinion - obviously most of you guys have different ones. Could you explain your rationale, please? I don't mean to start a flame war, I'm just curious. Thanks.

Oh, my settings? I've turned off torque and put on hard gunnery, landings, etc. I have also enabled spins because they're the only punishment for putting your a/c on the so-called razor's edge, and failing. As annoying as it is to fall towards the ground like a pinwheel while your would-be kill swoops away, it is much more realistic in my opinion.

Just my 2 cents... Have a good one, folks.

------------------
-KMHPaladin
- "The duty of the fighter pilot is to patrol his
area of the sky, and shoot down any enemy
fighters in that area. Anything else is rubbish."
Baron Manfred von Richthofen, 1917
- [email protected]

[This message has been edited by KMHPaladin (edited 10-08-1999).]


Posts: 794 | From: RPI - Troy, NY; originally from South Jersey | Registered: Sep 1999  |  IP: Logged
Opa
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posted 10-08-1999 01:14 PM     Profile for Opa   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message   Edit/Delete Post
Paladin.
I must admit, I sometimes use padlock, but only when within 400 metres. You have to spot the enemy without the padlock. I mean, Ctrl+T, then padlock. The computer shows you where the target is. That's too easy. Besides, where does target recognition come in? If you don't use padlock(HUD=Off, I presume?), you will have a much harder time identifying your target. You won't even know whether he's friendly or not. Now, THAT'S fun!

Besides, Alt+N and Time Acc. = CHEATING!!!!

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Der Opa


Posts: 710 | From: Sandnes, Rogaland, Norway | Registered: Sep 1999  |  IP: Logged
Blade
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posted 10-08-1999 02:27 PM     Profile for Blade   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message   Edit/Delete Post
Look, anything that makes life easier is not cheating. Since in EAW or all other flight sims, SA is not anywhere near what it would be like in real. Padlocking in EAW is not a prob for me since I feel its just an equalizer to the AI's ability to identify me at great distances well beyond the res of my monitor can reproduce. Also the AI's ability to see me flying down in the weeds when the AI is at a 1000's ft up. I have no chance without the padlock to see the AI AC down in the weeds when I am 1000's ft above.

Torque is not an issue in EAW since its not really model very well. There is very little effect from it. In MCFS (has trim and even blade pitch settings plus fuel mixtures also)the torque is very noticable on take offs and landings but again not much of a factor in a dogfight. As far as keeping a AC level in fight, torque is norm corrected by trim but since torque has so little effect in EAW, no real need for trim settings. If your AC doesn't fly level, maybe its not the torque but rather its the drift in your joystick.

Just IMO ramblings

Blade

[This message has been edited by Blade (edited 10-08-1999).]


Posts: 158 | From: Nepean, Onatrio, Canada | Registered: Sep 1999  |  IP: Logged
Karnak
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posted 10-08-1999 03:17 PM     Profile for Karnak   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message   Edit/Delete Post
DerAddler

Read my earlier post. Many WWII aircraft could not trim to level flight. I think someone had a post about the 109 having that problem as well. EAW effectively models a continuous aut trim due to its very weak torque effects.


Posts: 461 | From: San Rafael, California, USA | Registered: Sep 1999  |  IP: Logged
Opa
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posted 10-08-1999 03:18 PM     Profile for Opa   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message   Edit/Delete Post
I base my arguments on a very simple prinsciple: Real pilots don't have an unlimited supply of lives. That should make up for the AI, the undermodeling of this, and overmodeling of that.

And ze planes haf kamoflage for a reason, nein? It really VAS hard to spot ein Tommy down at ze deck! To your magical targeting tricks, I say: NEIN HELGA!!!

And Blade
Don't take everything I say so damn serious...


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Der Opa

[This message has been edited by Opa (edited 10-08-1999).]


Posts: 710 | From: Sandnes, Rogaland, Norway | Registered: Sep 1999  |  IP: Logged
Tailspin
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posted 10-08-1999 03:54 PM     Profile for Tailspin   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message   Edit/Delete Post
Well... I will agree that the torque setting is really not that big a deal in EAW. I like to keep it on if only to make take-offs harder. While I haven't tried MSCFS, in WB it is a challenge just to stay on the runway during takeoff because of torque modelling. WB's does have a trim control though. ER...Trust me it really does get easier. I'm no "ace" pilot but at least I can keep one in the air...Most of the time. I used to have trouble with basic manouvers. As for the padlock, I didn't start out using it because it was too disorienting...However I like the padlock in RB3D because it can be switched on and off with the one button on my stick. I've been wanting to map this feature to my stick in EAW, just haven't got around to it.
Posts: 1895 | From: Metropolis USA | Registered: Sep 1999  |  IP: Logged
Karnak
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posted 10-08-1999 07:13 PM     Profile for Karnak   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message   Edit/Delete Post
I have my F22 programmed to turn padlock on and off with the touch of a button. I use it because I feel that it makes the sim much more immersive. When you are rubber-necking and the are other aircraft all over the place it really feels great. I remember being bounced by a unknown number of Fw 190D-9s. After tangling with and then shooting one down, I looked around and saw that it was my flight of 4 Spitfire Mk XIVs against about 20 huns. I immediatly ordered a withdraw. In the end the score was 2 Fw 190s downed for no Spits lost. One of my flight got one before I did and then we all got home.
Posts: 461 | From: San Rafael, California, USA | Registered: Sep 1999  |  IP: Logged
Aaron
unregistered

posted 10-10-1999 05:49 PM       Edit/Delete Post
I'm no great pilot so I can get out of spins easy, LOTS of practice.
I fly with torque on, spins and stalls on, real guns limited ammo, but I cheat like hell when it comes to the visual because it tough to keep track of those little specks Microprose calls airplanes. (never mind the tiny text) Granted I'm flying above 640x480.

Anyone that uses the cockpit on, no padlock, real snap views is too damn tough for me. It is like trying to box with a halloween mask on.


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Edwin Rommel
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posted 10-11-1999 01:25 AM     Profile for Edwin Rommel   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message   Edit/Delete Post
Mein Herren
Maybe ze rollenunpitchenmekkenpuckensctick (joystick) ist shot (Herr Blade), but I find myself "drifting" behind the target A/C zo much zat I cannot get a proper shot with "full" settings. With ze "max" torque ze A/C also tilt ze wings (I zometimes fly ze captured Tommy flugzeuge with KG 200), und this makes me miss even more with with ze wing-mounted guns. My respect for the real-life WWII aces grow by the hour !

Herr Opa : Ach to be ze student again- wiv ze ability to zit zere fur hours navigating und listening to directions from LOKI on how to get to ze ziel- Ze wife und kinder do not allow me zat luxury !

Mein Herren, I spend ze whole week-end waiting for zis "mysterious" geese zat I set ze BirdSeed = 30 for, und still nichts appeared, had anybody really seen zis geese??

Danke

E.R.


Posts: 4399 | From: Dusty Oasis, Nord Afrika | Registered: Sep 1999  |  IP: Logged
Opa
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posted 10-11-1999 11:44 AM     Profile for Opa   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message   Edit/Delete Post
I think Pasha saw them, and managed to get screenshots of them.

Just to add something on the Alt+N-thing....Not only do I gain an altitude advantage(historically accurate! Yeah!), but the fights are more varied. Head-on staffel attacks never occur anymore. Sometimes my staffel encounters elements of Tommies that are returning from a fight with other Emils....sometimes we catch them while they're landing...

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Der Opa

[This message has been edited by Opa (edited 10-11-1999).]


Posts: 710 | From: Sandnes, Rogaland, Norway | Registered: Sep 1999  |  IP: Logged
Blade
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posted 10-12-1999 08:59 AM     Profile for Blade   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message   Edit/Delete Post
Opa,

No prob....8)

Blade


Posts: 158 | From: Nepean, Onatrio, Canada | Registered: Sep 1999  |  IP: Logged
Opa
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posted 10-12-1999 11:29 AM     Profile for Opa   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message   Edit/Delete Post
Gut, Blade! Now, Du und Ich go und smoke ze peace pipe, nein?

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Der Opa


Posts: 710 | From: Sandnes, Rogaland, Norway | Registered: Sep 1999  |  IP: Logged
Wrangler Wolf
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posted 10-15-1999 03:05 AM     Profile for Wrangler Wolf   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message   Edit/Delete Post
in eaw.ini, next "ExtraSquads" is

"BirdSeed=30"

what is this?


Posts: 22 | From: Barcelona | Registered: Oct 1999  |  IP: Logged
Edwin Rommel
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posted 10-15-1999 03:28 AM     Profile for Edwin Rommel   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message   Edit/Delete Post
Herr Strangler Wulf-
Trust a wulf to be interested in ze geese ja?- See earlier in the thread- Apparently some of the fliegers have seen geese flying in EAW- und some has even made piktures of zis- I have never seen this- Setting up BirdSeed = 30 makes ze more birds come to ze more seed? I have yet to zee this happening Spend a whole week-end sitting mit ze shotgun by ze lake close to mein fliegplatz, and flying low over ze country-side (about 3000 ft) still no geese.

Viel Gluck- Let us know if you find zhem- even better- take ze Screenshot und post it !

E.R.


Posts: 4399 | From: Dusty Oasis, Nord Afrika | Registered: Sep 1999  |  IP: Logged
bigmac
unregistered

posted 10-15-1999 02:54 PM       Edit/Delete Post
Excellent topic! OK, I'll throw in my two cents... Everything maxed, armor patch, NO waypoint jumping, no external views. Currently I'm flying with no HUD. I did like the idea of flying with it on in order to give me an indication when I'm "departing", which I do a lot during a dogfight... I don't have a force feedback joystick. I'm left handed and have to settle for a Cyborg 3D for my gaming (any left handed ff joysticks out there?). I'll have to give this a try. I don't agree with enabling the next/nearest enemy padlock, yet feel padlock is essential (lose sight, lose the fight). The way I get around this is by having a button on my stick set for boresight padlock. That way, when I get in the saddle, I padlock him (that's not cheating, is it?) I feel this gives me an adequate level of "realism". As he attempts to maneuver, I can track and counter... I agree, you shouldn't be able to easily pick out a bogey on the deck that's attempting to extend. I force myself to actually observe them in virtual cockpit while scanning the skies. I use the mouse for my head swivel. I initially had trouble doing this because the mouse camera movement was counter-intuitive. A trick I discovered was that if you physically flip the mouses vertical axis, i.e., cord coming out of from the bottom, the head swivel is sharp and precise. I use Game Commander for everything else (this is awesome!!). I feel extremely lucky to bag 3 victories in a mission. Some missions I don't score any. I think this is closer to the actual situation than the alternatives. I love this game!!
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Wrangler Wolf
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posted 10-16-1999 03:52 AM     Profile for Wrangler Wolf   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message   Edit/Delete Post
Vielen danke, herr Rommel!

But, the only birds what i want to see are the tommy's und indianer went to heart after
eat a lot of my 20mm rounds!

HORRIDO!
und gut jäge!

PS: sorry for my bad english und deutsch.


Posts: 22 | From: Barcelona | Registered: Oct 1999  |  IP: Logged

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