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Author Topic: Dogfights in Books?
MovinTarget
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posted 04-10-2000 04:45 AM       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote
Hi,
I was wondering if anyone could recommend any books/authors with good air combat scenes and what your opinions are?

As a sample I've read:

Firefox/Down (and other Craig Thomas books) The *best* in my opinion, really visual.

Storming Intrepid/Thunder of Erebus (Payne Harrison): Again really good not as easy to *see* the fight but some really great detail.

Dale Brown: Umm...no comment...

Tom Clancy: Some nice details but ground/sea combat is better described than aerial.

Stephen Coonts: Unusual, I really enjoyed the combat scenes in Flight of the Intruder but Final Flight was nowhere near as good.

Any recommendations/comments?

Cheers


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Legacy
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posted 04-10-2000 10:44 AM     Profile for Legacy   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message   Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote
1.Air Warriors: The Inside Story of the Making of a Navy Pilot by Douglas C. Walter (1998)
2.Bogey and Bandits: The Making of a Fighter Pilot by Robert Gandt (1997)
3.The Sixth Battle by Barrett Tillman (1992)
4.War in the Air : True Accounts of the 2Oth Century's Most Dramatic Air Battles by the Men Who Fought Them
by Stephen Coonts (1997)
5.Fly Off by Bob Norris (1999)
6.Check-Six! by Bob Norris (1998).

I liked them all even though sometimes they are more or less accurate in describing some of the aerial battles.

[This message has been edited by Legacy (edited 04-10-2000).]


Posts: 33 | From: Landing, NJ 07850 | Registered: Sep 1999  |  IP: Logged
Lucky_1
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posted 04-10-2000 10:59 AM     Profile for Lucky_1   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message   Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote
I just finished a book called "IronClaw" A true story about a Prowler pilot during the Gulf War. Very good story.

While Bogeys and Bandits, and Making of a fighter pilot are good, they are about training. This book is combat.

I would also recommend vintage books by Chuck Yeager and Bud Anderson. "To fly and fight" by anderson and Yeager, by(who else) Yeager.

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Posts: 635 | From: Knoxville, TN. | Registered: Sep 1999  |  IP: Logged
patriotSTORM
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posted 04-10-2000 04:32 PM     Profile for patriotSTORM   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message   Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote
If you are looking for dogfights, you just cant get better than Biggles! Still got those books from my childhood.......a blast every time you read them! I personnaly think that the best dogfights are those written by the pilots themselves on ops they flew. Douglas Baders book was a great insight, and I hear that Tornado Down by John Nichols (??) is a good version of modern combat (but this is not air-to-air).

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Posts: 404 | From: New Zealand | Registered: Dec 1999  |  IP: Logged
Ozias
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posted 04-10-2000 05:52 PM       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote
John Nicholls was one of the two torndao crew shot down and captured during the Gulf War, who was then forced to appear on Iraqi TV denouncing the war.

He wrote an account of the events, 'Tornado down'. I believe he has written a few other novels as well, one was about a hi-tech stealth variant of the Tornado ADV.


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Burner*
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posted 04-10-2000 06:57 PM     Profile for Burner*     Send New Private Message   Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote
There is a series of two books called "Rules Of Engagement", they are about a F4 pilot and are set during the Vietnam War. I really enjoyed reading them, the action and storyline kept me busy on the flight for NY to Hawaii :^)

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"Fighter pilots make movies. Attack pilots make shitty movies. And don't believe those mudmovers who try to talk about history, either. Without the air-to-air stuff, I'll tell ya who's history" -Quote From www.f-16.net


Posts: 53 | From: angels 28 | Registered: Sep 1999  |  IP: Logged
Andy Bush
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posted 04-10-2000 07:52 PM     Profile for Andy Bush   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message   Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote
MT

Look for Tom Wilson's 'Termite Hill', about Weasel Thuds in VN. This book (and its sequel) is about as good a Vietnam story as you will find.

Try Derek Robinson's 'Piece Of Cake', Battle Of Britain story of a Hurricane squadron. This book alone should strip away all of the Hollywood BS that surrounds air combat.


Posts: 595 | From: St Louis, Mo | Registered: Sep 1999  |  IP: Logged
Wrench
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posted 04-11-2000 12:44 AM     Profile for Wrench   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message   Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote
Another of my favorite subjects: books (along with movies )

The "HOGS" series is pretty good (A10's in the Gulf - no real dogfighting as yet in the first 3)
Son of Thunder by JD Wetterling (sp?) F100 jock in S.Vietnam - a/g action

For pure fun (and fantasy!!!) The Wingman series by Mack Maloney -- 16 so far and counting (although some are out of print)

First Air by Michael Skinner is a good read (fictional Gulf War scenario - merc-type pilots)

Top Guns by Joe Foss/Matthew Brennan - real stories of US aces

Carrier series - only read 2, not too bad

Warbirds
Force of Eagles
Firebreak
Dark Wing
Iron Gate
all by Richard S Herman jr -- EXCELLENT books!!!!! (they'd make great movies, too!)

There are many other, these are just my 'quick picks'
Wrench
Kevin Stein


Posts: 22 | From: Los Angeles, CA, USA | Registered: Oct 1999  |  IP: Logged
Legacy
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posted 04-11-2000 11:53 PM     Profile for Legacy   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message   Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote
patriotSTORM, who's the author of those Douglas Bader books you mentioned? If memory serves me right, one of them was the first book about plane and dogfights I read. It's probably been some 10-15 years since then and I was in another country back then, but I still recall fragments from that book. I would love to read it (them) again, this time in English, that is if I can find it (them) first.
Posts: 33 | From: Landing, NJ 07850 | Registered: Sep 1999  |  IP: Logged
patriotSTORM
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posted 04-12-2000 04:58 PM     Profile for patriotSTORM   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message   Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote
Legacy, the book is "REACH FOR THE SKY the story of douglas bader" by Paul Brickhill. My copy (english) was published in 1955, and I am not sure if it has been reprinted since. Well worth the effort to find it, though.

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Jason
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posted 04-12-2000 07:21 PM     Profile for Jason   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message   Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote
i know a really good book. it is called "Strike Eagles in the Gulf" excellent book, it isn't too good in the dogfight department because there wasn't much at all with the strike eagle but it tells you so much about the F-15E I would just read it a second time just for the sake of enjoyment.

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Posts: 220 | From: | Registered: Dec 1999  |  IP: Logged
Legacy
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posted 04-12-2000 08:44 PM     Profile for Legacy   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message   Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote
Thanks, patriotSTORM. For anybody who's interested, "REACH FOR THE SKY" (the story of Douglas Bader) by Paul Brickhill can be found at Amazon. I better hurry up and order my copy...
Posts: 33 | From: Landing, NJ 07850 | Registered: Sep 1999  |  IP: Logged
patriotSTORM
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posted 04-13-2000 05:27 PM     Profile for patriotSTORM   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message   Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote
Anyone else here read Biggles? Or is it just me?

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Posts: 404 | From: New Zealand | Registered: Dec 1999  |  IP: Logged
Caveman
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posted 04-13-2000 05:40 PM     Profile for Caveman   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message   Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote
What's wrong with Dale Brown?

I thoroughly enjoyed reading "Day of the Cheetah". Hasn't anyone else read this book. Yes, it was a bit contrived in spots but the pilot/plane interaction "concepts" it suggested weren't that far from what's being researched now (and even as far back as about 10 years ago).

And of course... There's always Yeager's autobiography; some fantastic ogfighting/test flying stories there.


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Chino
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posted 04-14-2000 12:14 PM     Profile for Chino   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message   Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote
Man, everybody beat me to my favorite books here! I won't second all those motions, but one author I didn't see mentioned was Larry Bond. He has several "possible war" books that are excellent in naval, ground, AND air warfare descriptions -- accurate and well-written. Great air scenes especially in "Cauldron" (European war circa 2000) and "Red Phoenix" (second Korean war early 1990's, great F-16 scenes). AND ALSO, "Fighter (The Battle of Britain)" by Len Deighton -- non-fiction, great writing about all aspects of the BoB.
Posts: 57 | From: Westborough, MA, USA | Registered: Feb 2000  |  IP: Logged

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