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Author Topic: Enola Gay's Bombardier Dies-No Regrets To The End.
'
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posted 03-31-2000 10:18 PM     Profile for '   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message   Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote
"another thing that makes me sick is censorship by the way. How come this board turns the word B_U_L_L_S_H_I_T into stars?"
We have ladies on this forum. I don't know if I said enough.
When we see stars, we still get the idea.
If the real world is already full of your favourite words, why not have the virtual one more, or less clean.

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Posts: 445 | From: Canada | Registered: Mar 2000  |  IP: Logged
Wallimiyama
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posted 04-01-2000 09:22 AM     Profile for Wallimiyama   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message   Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote
Thank you Cookie, for your open minded attitude and tolerance of other's opinions. By the way, speaking of bull****, have you ever been warned to stay off the streets in a foreign country because your haircut marks you as an American citizen? I have.

I travel a great deal in Western Europe and have never had a serious problem with the local citizens. Some serious debates in the pubs to be sure, but so far I've been generally welcomed.
Not true in Central and South America. Southeast Asia and the Middle East are even worse. When my local contact tells me to try and use some German in my daily speech and suggests that I purchase eye glasses that are more European, so to pass as German instead of American, that's an eye-opener.

This isn't really the place for this thread so I won't post further.
Thanks again for your tolerance. I suppose we both may have a problem with distinguishing personal experience from generally held attitudes/stereotypes.

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-Wally

Are we havin' fun yet?


Posts: 34 | From: Wernersville, PA | Registered: Mar 2000  |  IP: Logged
Cookie
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posted 04-01-2000 11:36 AM     Profile for Cookie   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message   Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote
Wallimiyama, please understand that I do tolerate your opinion. All I wanted to say is that the "facts" in that editorial you posted are plain wrong. Please donīt think Iīm trying to bash the States or something, far from it. Itīs just that most foreign people react a little allergic to this kind of self-praise (is that a word?).

Anyway, Iīm running a little short on time right now, so I canīt discuss this in greater detail right now. but I do hope though you will still be around later on, so we can continue this discussion, even though it may be in the wrong place.

By the way, I didnīt really understand what you wanted to say in your last post (I mean that literally, English is not my first language). Iīm used to being hated in a lot of countries because I happen to be German, but somehow I have the feeling that you wanted to say something different. Please donīt take this as a smartass comment, I really just didnīt understand what you wanted to say.


Posts: 685 | From: Dortmund, Germany | Registered: Nov 1999  |  IP: Logged
Ghostrider
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posted 04-01-2000 01:17 PM     Profile for Ghostrider   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message   Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote
President Truman warned Japan; that if they did'nt surrender they would face a bomb such as had never been seen before. The US dropped leaflets for days warning people of what was to come. I have never visited Japan and so I can't speak from personal experiance, however I too have read of the inhuman actions of the Japs. 17 or 18 percent of the pows in Jap hands died compared to 5 or 6 percent of those held by the Germans. When some moron asked Truman if he had apologised to Japan for dropping the bombs, re replied that he did'nt recall the Japs apologising for Pearl Harbor. As far as I know they never have ether. As far as a citisen being held responsible for his leaders actions look at the morally corrupt buffoon we have in the White house and if you beleive polls, the majority of people see nothing wrong with his actions... What does that say about us? Have we as a nation become so morally sick that we don'nt even recoginise lieing, cheating and stealing in others? While Hitler was in power, what do you think would have happened to the average German citisen who said "Down with Hitler!" Some of his own officers tried to kill him and look what that madman did.
Thanks to the Gentleman who corrected one of our writers on this forum who compained that he was being censered because of his gutter mouth. Quite right, when a person can't or won't express himself without stooping to foul language, he or she does'nt have anything to say that I would pay any attention to. Well that's off my chest. I see my spelling is going downhill, as well as my grammer. I ended a sentence with a preposistion a little while back. Ah well, back to flying..

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Cry Havoc; and let slip the dogs of war!


Posts: 75 | From: Wash, Pa. | Registered: Jan 2000  |  IP: Logged
Lud von Pipper
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posted 04-01-2000 03:28 PM     Profile for Lud von Pipper   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message   Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote
Hunter Cole:
You are right, got confused, and this is my fault!

...still, this does not changes the substance of what I was talking about.


Posts: 273 | From: Italy | Registered: Sep 1999  |  IP: Logged
JayP
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posted 04-02-2000 12:57 AM     Profile for JayP   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message   Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote
Latin America, Southeast Asia, the Middle East; all regions in which the United States has overtly or covertly overthrown governments within living memory.
Posts: 531 | From: | Registered: Nov 1999  |  IP: Logged
Ghostrider
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posted 04-02-2000 10:30 AM     Profile for Ghostrider   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message   Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote
quote:
Originally posted by JayP:
Latin America, Southeast Asia, the Middle East; all regions in which the United States has overtly or covertly overthrown governments within living memory.

Would you mind sharing with me just what governments the US has overthrown? I'm not aware of any, and I have a Masters degree in Political Science. You remind me of folks who love to pontificate, and when asked to name times, dates, and sources, they can't because there is no basis for their statements.

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Cry Havoc; and let slip the dogs of war!


Posts: 75 | From: Wash, Pa. | Registered: Jan 2000  |  IP: Logged
JayP
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posted 04-02-2000 12:14 PM     Profile for JayP   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message   Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote
Countries in which the United States has interfered with the local political process:

Iran, Chile, Nicaragua, Vietnam.

Perhaps I should make clear that my purpose is not to condemn the United States for its actions in these cases. Rather, my point is that the hostility towards the U.S. that exists in various parts of the world can be explained in part by its actions.

[This message has been edited by JayP (edited 04-02-2000).]


Posts: 531 | From: | Registered: Nov 1999  |  IP: Logged
Hevyg
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posted 04-02-2000 01:32 PM     Profile for Hevyg   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message   Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote
A Degree in Political Science is a wonderful thing, but how much History and/or World Affairs did you bolster all those admirable theories with? How would we use Political Science to explain the differences between life in the US vs. life in the Soviet Union, when the constitutions were very similar in theme and content?

Recall as recently as the 1980's, when President Reagan sought outside financing to pursue his administration's private agenda (as opposed to public agenda, since Congress denied him the funds)against the Communist (yet sovereign) government of Daniel Ortega in Nicaragua. Is there a dispute that WE mined their harbors? Is there a dispute that OUR C-130 gunships shredded Sandinista encampments from bases US bases in Honduras?
We're no better that any other people on this planet...no matter what are our intentions.


Posts: 120 | From: Puget Sound | Registered: Jan 2000  |  IP: Logged
Ghostrider
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posted 04-02-2000 06:44 PM     Profile for Ghostrider   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message   Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote
Theories? My dear sir, the only friend that we had in the Middle East was Anwar Sadat, and he was killed for his pro American views. The British sold out the Isralies, for God knows what reason..... Bye the bye the more I read of british history, the more I am disliking them, even though my wife is British, and I adore her beyond reason, The fact that the British interned jews on Cyprus, for trying to defend their homeland defies reason. And then when the United nations vote was a certainty for proclaming Isreal an Independant nation, turned over arms and supplies to the Arabs, and the Isralies were left to defend themselves with next to nothing; I see nothing to admire the British for. It's true with Winston Churchill, the British stood alone against the Germans, and I admire them for that, The world does, but it was shameful what they did against the Jews....

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Cry Havoc; and let slip the dogs of war!


Posts: 75 | From: Wash, Pa. | Registered: Jan 2000  |  IP: Logged
Bogey
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posted 04-03-2000 09:36 AM     Profile for Bogey   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message   Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote
You just don't get it do you?
ANY DAMN COUNTRY that interferes with other nation's affairs is BAD!
There is NO excuse for it!
It just happens that the US is world leading in sticking it's big deadly nose into too many poor countries' business.

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Up there, where the air is rare...


Posts: 339 | From: West coast of Sweden | Registered: Nov 1999  |  IP: Logged
Vector
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posted 04-03-2000 11:34 AM     Profile for Vector   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message   Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote
quote:
Originally posted by ':
"another thing that makes me sick is censorship by the way. How come this board turns the word B_U_L_L_S_H_I_T into stars?"
We have ladies on this forum. I don't know if I said enough.
When we see stars, we still get the idea.
If the real world is already full of your favourite words, why not have the virtual one more, or less clean.


Erm, that's pretty much a sexist remark. Are you suggesting that the female contingient of readers here cannot handle a bit of colourfull metaphor?

I also believe in free speech and non-censorship. The real world is already full of supression, why not keep this virtual world truly free. Hell, in Canada on some networks they let you swear on tv.

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-\/ector, Flight Sim Sympathizer

[This message has been edited by Vector (edited 04-03-2000).]


Posts: 903 | From: Comox, BC, Canada | Registered: Oct 1999  |  IP: Logged
Lud von Pipper
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posted 04-03-2000 08:04 PM     Profile for Lud von Pipper   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message   Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote
Very well said Bogey!

LvP


Posts: 273 | From: Italy | Registered: Sep 1999  |  IP: Logged
'
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posted 04-03-2000 09:20 PM     Profile for '   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message   Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote
"Are you suggesting that the female contingient of readers here cannot handle a bit of colourfull metaphor?"

Well, If a female swears in front of a man, it means, that she doesn't want to be treated as a WOMAN. If a man swears in front of female, it means, he doesn't want to treat her as a WOMAN. That's how I look at it.
It doesn't mean that a woman doesn't have to swear at all. There are situations, when it's RECOMMENDED. For stress releif. In that case, hey, what the heck! I hurt myself millions of times, you wouldn't want to be near, to hear, it would hurt the ear. But swearing for no reason, and from the women, or in front of her...naaah.
That's my opinion.
BTW. Every time I was treating a woman, as it was ,let's say 100 years, or before, she was melting. Which made me very happy, after .

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Posts: 445 | From: Canada | Registered: Mar 2000  |  IP: Logged
Hevyg
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posted 04-04-2000 09:46 AM     Profile for Hevyg   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message   Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote
Wow! They let you swear on TV in Canada? Talk about civilized. I always admired their universal health care system, but that pales in light of this information.
Posts: 120 | From: Puget Sound | Registered: Jan 2000  |  IP: Logged
Vector
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posted 04-04-2000 11:55 AM     Profile for Vector   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message   Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote
Yes It can get quite, "extreme", on late night Canadian comedy. It is very much more like British and European humor compared to the United States. There is even some nudity.

But there is one show we picked up from the US called Dennis Miller Live. It's about American stuff yet the guy swears like he was Canadian . They might block it out in the states but on our networks he can go full force. It's all in good taste though, I assure you. I like Canadian humor above all else, it's new and refreshing and we won't take **** from anybody!

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-\/ector, Flight Sim Sympathizer

[This message has been edited by Vector (edited 04-04-2000).]


Posts: 903 | From: Comox, BC, Canada | Registered: Oct 1999  |  IP: Logged
Roger Helmich
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posted 04-07-2000 12:42 AM     Profile for Roger Helmich   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message   Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote
Nazi's invaded Poland and almost every other country in Europe.
Imperial Forces of Japan bombed Pearl Harbour.
Anybody from Austraila want to comment on the war and what they thought of the Nation of Japan during the war?
We were Dragged into WWII Just as we were WWI. Does the term " policy of isolationism," ring any bells with any of the American Scholars out there.
For the foreign Scholars a little American History lesson-
After WWI as before, America really was not to interested in being involved in world politics.Does anyone remeber the League of Nations.
America was too interested in Mom's Apple Pie, and wished that the rest of the world would just get along without us.
Well, the League of Nations was not a sucess,and Hitler came to power during economic crisis.
A few years later WWII ensued.
And America wished that the world would take care of itself.

Then, On December 7, 1941 the world changed forever.

interesting tidbit-Question What caused America to start the Manhatten Project?
a. because we wanted to get even with Japan
b. America wanted to take over the world
c. Nazi's had their own Manhatten Project
d. America was bored

answer:c- Nazi's had their own Manhatten Project( and missle program)

To all the pacifists out there what language do you think you would be speaking if it weren't for America
Do you suppose that you would be able to express yourself as freely as you do on this fourm if America wasn't around.
After the war was over we rebuilt Europe and Japan. We did not act as conquers, we gave the world back to itself.
Then The Berlin Airlift happened- history lesson for the next American bashing day.

War is Hell.
We did not start it, but we sure did end that one....
R


Posts: 35 | From: Hurst, TX USA | Registered: Mar 2000  |  IP: Logged
Bogey
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posted 04-07-2000 04:53 AM     Profile for Bogey   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message   Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote
The US still "occupy" many islands in the pacific, and to some extent, Japan.
"Give the world back"?

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Up there, where the air is rare...


Posts: 339 | From: West coast of Sweden | Registered: Nov 1999  |  IP: Logged
Andy Bush
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posted 04-07-2000 05:12 AM     Profile for Andy Bush   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message   Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote
>>ANY DAMN COUNTRY that interferes with other nation's affairs is BAD!
There is NO excuse for it!<<

At face value, that is a wonderful concept...and about as realistic as the idea of an automobile engine that can run on water.

But, just for the sake of discussion, what about the situation in Europe in 1938-39? Most historians now feel that Hitler could have been stopped when he moved on Czechoslovakia. But neither France or Britain had the political stomach for that.

Is it your position that the resulting outcome was somehow 'right' in that the Nazis were allowed to continue on in their grab for territory without being interferred with by another nation?

Tell us more about your justification for non-intervention. Do you really see 'NO excuse' for stopping evil?



Posts: 595 | From: St Louis, Mo | Registered: Sep 1999  |  IP: Logged
Roger Helmich
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posted 04-07-2000 08:49 AM     Profile for Roger Helmich   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message   Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote
Someone interfere with Hitler?
I thought that at the top of your paragraph you just stated that ANY DAMN COUNTRY which interfers is BAD
Which is it?

As for what you call justification for non-intervention
The policy of isolationism is what Historians refer to as the US position prior to WWI and what they attempted to return to after the war. Historians list the main reason that the Leauge of Nations failed is the lack of US involvement.
President Wilson wanted US involvement he just did not have the support of the Congress and The League of Nations failed.
Anymore discussions in history please refer to your High School Textbook.
This is so basic.
R


Posts: 35 | From: Hurst, TX USA | Registered: Mar 2000  |  IP: Logged
Roger Helmich
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posted 04-07-2000 09:01 AM     Profile for Roger Helmich   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message   Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote
To the individual from Sweden,
If your term occupy means that a US base is present- then you are right
If it means that the US is interfering in that countries day to day Poltics then which one are you talking of?
The philipines?GUAM?

Hey why just pick on the Pacific Relm?
What About Cuba?
You know, the US military base in Cuba.

But before we start disscussing the Bay of Pigs, please tell me that you know what the Monroe Doctirine is......


Posts: 35 | From: Hurst, TX USA | Registered: Mar 2000  |  IP: Logged
Vector
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Member # 463

posted 04-07-2000 10:44 AM     Profile for Vector   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message   Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote
"At face value, that is a wonderful concept...and about as realistic as the idea of an
automobile engine that can run on water."

They are called hydrogen fuel cells, the hydrogen is refined from H20. When they are running, their only byproduct is water.

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-\/ector, Flight Sim Sympathizer


Posts: 903 | From: Comox, BC, Canada | Registered: Oct 1999  |  IP: Logged

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