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Author Topic: Superhornet: Will it have a true "mission builder"?
Jon
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Member # 324

posted 09-28-1999 07:20 PM     Profile for Jon   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message   Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote
Topic says it all. How 'bout it Viking? I know I'm beating it to death. I'll be glad to stop once I get some form of answer. Thanks.


Jon


Posts: 135 | From: Rochester, NY USA | Registered: Sep 1999  |  IP: Logged
Ziggi
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posted 09-29-1999 11:40 PM       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote
I read a post over on 'simhq' by Richard 'Flex' Hawley on this subject. He saw Super Hornet at ETCS and said that the version that was demoed there had no mission builder in it. Instead, it had a mission planner similar to what DIs F16 had which allowed you to edit waypoints etc for the scripted missions that where in the game. He wasn't sure how the game would be released but speculated that there would be no mission builder in the game for its first release and that there might be a mission builder made available at some future time.
Bummer ...

Ziggi


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mbaxter
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posted 09-30-1999 06:34 AM     Profile for mbaxter   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message   Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote
Big mistake on DI's part. Without a dynamic campaign, a mission builder is a must. I won't be buying this sim.
Posts: 1687 | From: USA | Registered: Sep 1999  |  IP: Logged
Vector
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posted 10-01-1999 11:16 AM       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote
Just wait for the Gold version.
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Rick.50cal
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posted 10-01-1999 12:56 PM     Profile for Rick.50cal     Send New Private Message   Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote
If there is no one buying the first version, what incentive is there for DI to make the "gold" version with editor? They need the income, although I understand the point.

Many people don't think twice about spending the same money on a lame 1 person shooter, and those are less complex. I

on a side note, DID is now gone completely. an official press release from infogames is expected soon.

I plan on buying DI's SH, Janes F18, B-17II, and any other decent combat sim, before it's too late!

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Rick.50cal


Posts: 520 | From: Vancouver, BC, Canada | Registered: Sep 1999  |  IP: Logged
Yogi
unregistered

posted 10-01-1999 06:46 PM       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote
Well, Rick.50cal has a point......if the first version doesnt sell, there may not be a Gold. But damn, is there no one in management that is capable of comprehending that it maybe didnt sell 'cause it didnt offer us much. If they are going to design a so called "hardcore" sim, then make it hardcore. No mission builder and/or campaign is a big blunder.....it may be a hardcore simulation of an FA18E, it isnt a hardcore simulation of an FA18E at war. Which is why I
buy these things, to fight and fly. If it doesnt sell its their fault, for not giving us the real deal. I can sure wait a couple months....Mig Alley will keep me company

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Rick.50cal
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posted 10-01-1999 08:59 PM     Profile for Rick.50cal     Send New Private Message   Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote
I really hope DI decides to postpone their SH for a few months to include the "Gold" content, or they will not get expected sales...

OR..

Get the first version out, I will buy it ASAP, before it disapears all together.


Really it's our own fault (flight sim junkies, that is): we do exhaustive reviews of games that are far beyond the complexity of any other game, and then dismis it as "junk" "return it" "don't even bother", after the dev team spent two years and 1/2 to 3 million dollars and countless sleepless nights to bring it to us.

No wonder development team members are leaving in droves. They could probably make more money for less agravation, more time off and feel work is FUN again, instead of worrying about the cage modes of an AIM-9X... or play balancing the PK of various BVR weapons.

All I can say is: I'm glad I'm not in their shoes! I like flying their product, but I don't envy their job...

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Rick.50cal


Posts: 520 | From: Vancouver, BC, Canada | Registered: Sep 1999  |  IP: Logged
Bigshot
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posted 10-01-1999 09:23 PM     Profile for Bigshot   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message   Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote
Superhornet has a random mission builder. Go to interplay.com. They have some info on it.
Posts: 1291 | From: Suttons Bay, MI, USA | Registered: Sep 1999  |  IP: Logged
Bigshot
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posted 10-01-1999 09:47 PM     Profile for Bigshot   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message   Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote
Make that a random mission generator. Whatever that means?
Posts: 1291 | From: Suttons Bay, MI, USA | Registered: Sep 1999  |  IP: Logged
mbaxter
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posted 10-01-1999 11:01 PM     Profile for mbaxter   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message   Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote
The "Give me Hard-Core of Give me Death" crowd is to blame for the problems Rick described above. Too many companies are making the mistake of catering exclusively to this crowd at the expense of gameplay.

Personally, I'm not that into utlra-detailed system modeling, radar modes, and other nit-picking details. I just want the sim to be interesting, fun, and have a lot of replay value. I want great graphics that give a real feeling of flight, like the terrain engine in JSF, for example. I want the flight model to feel like an airplane, with stalls, spins, etc modeled. I want weapons performance to be as close to real-world as possible. I expect wingmen to work properly, and I also expect at least a mission builder, though what I'd really love is a dynamic campaign buider.

Now, a sim developer can acheive all that assuming that you don't attempt to also model every aspect of the aircraft in extruciating detail. The problem is that sim developers do the opposite. They neglect the really important issues in order to satisfy all the anal, nitpicking demands of the self-proclaimed ultra-harcore crowd.

That's why sims like EF2000 and Fighters Anthology sold in droves and made big profits while sims like F4 and F-15 are lucky to get by without a net loss. Go to the Jane's Combat.Net and you'll see what I'm talking about. FA is still the most widely played game, with far more people playing it than any of the other Jane's sims. The only ones that approach FA in popularity are IAF and WWII Fighters, both of which are widely condemned as "Light" or "Survey" sims. See the pattern here?

The point is, you don't have to model every little system to make the game realistic. You simply have to model AI, weapons, and flight model to accomplish realism. Throw in a mission or campaign builder and solid multiplayer and you've got one hell of a good game that will appeal to a broad crowd and actually (God forbid) make money!

USAF will make money. Future follow-ons to USAF will make money. As much as I hate to admit it, Novalogic sims will continue to make good money as well.

SH, F2, F4, etc probably won't make much money.

A compromise between the two genres needs to be found, something like EF2000 or JSF. Jane's is going the right way with USAF. I hope they follow on with more like it, except with some kind of dynamic campaign as well.

[This message has been edited by mbaxter (edited 10-01-1999).]


Posts: 1687 | From: USA | Registered: Sep 1999  |  IP: Logged
Calum Keen
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posted 10-03-1999 02:43 AM     Profile for Calum Keen   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message   Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote
Spot on !
What people tend to forget is that it takes anywhere between 3-5 years to train the fledgling pilot into someone who will hopefully produce the goods,should his country call on him.
We joe public shouldn't really care that the new sim has 8 fully functioning radar types,and all of a sudden,what trainee pilots take time over we have a tendancy to want to go out and shoot lots of things down and blow lots of things up,all within 24 hrs of loading it onto our pc's.
Whilst I can also appreciate the more realism involved,this tends to push the minimum specs higher also,how many people would go out and buy a sim,if for example,unless you successfully completed the training modes to a certain "pass" mark,that the combat side of the sim was actually "locked"and prevented you for being prepared for the "real thing",now that's realism gentlemen!!

Posts: 20 | From: Scotland | Registered: Sep 1999  |  IP: Logged

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