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»  COMBATSIM.COM ARCHIVE FORUM   » Game Discussions (Title-specific)   » Flanker 2.0   » You want some bugs?

   
Author Topic: You want some bugs?
Russian Pilots Team
unregistered

posted 11-06-1999 06:14 PM       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote
Well, you thinkin what technical specs for your Su and others planes is real
in the game? Nope! I have one of a more example. In altitude band 1000-2000ì
speed F-16C (60 % fuel, guns only) does not drop below
800 kms /h regardless of the fact that he gets up. Closed loop? Please,
enters on speed 800, on
ASCENDING part is accelerated up to 950, leaves from Closed loops - speed
1100+. Thus
turn rate not drops. That him simplly to see in HUD, and I any more do not
speak about approach in an aft hemisphere,
It is necessary to do make not yo-yo and split - S. In 90 % cases a picture
such: long trying to see him, we lose
all energy up to speed somewhere 300, catch him in helmet, we see on HUD:
our speed 300,
the target's speed - 800 +. That speed range on which the greatest corner
plateau for Falcon - 610-750 Km /h. What for to him our speed all is more,
if equally 300 - it is not clear. At a supersmall altitude ours
speed, again 300, and him is 430 in "Steadied" flat turn on completely to
the handle, extended on, and screaming "Maximum AOA" Nadia. And he spit on
ours PGO, thrust\weight ratio 1.1 and overstability on supercritical angles.We have: I one on Su-33 against two Ukrainian bots on Excellent on the same
machines. Guns only.
We begin to be twisted. In 8 cases from ten ( flied of missions 50) enemies
are fitted in each other
Because build of itself Kvochur with Averyanov, thus that who was guilty (by
debrifing) - Blows up, and second - anything.

We go further.

Yes agree, on not to a supersmall altitude them It is difficult to shake
from a tail, because
They twist, basically, Low-Yo-Yo when feel, that lose lead. We fall on 30ì.
For low-yo-yo there is no reserve.
Speed while maneuvering on supersmall drops up to 300, so on hi-yo-yo not
suffices (as it seems) energy. Also flies he as the ram on a flat sine wave,
only changes
course as a sailing frigate. Good I think, take me. I retract an
afterburning. The altitude 10m, flying is direct, nobody I touch. 1 minute -
anything, 1.5 minutes - anything. Split-S and padlock -
nothing to padlock. We cut down, we look the track. Is clarified following:
sits boton a tail but hardly above. Suddenly starts to twist the "weighted"
barrel (at the altitude 20m). It was not pleasant, one more. Bum! - is
fitted in the ground ( I on him never have shot even). You are asked, if
such advanced AI, what for serviceable machine in ground to stick?
Where reason?..

And more:

First: If to lean(base) on Flanker 2, Su-27, ours by all liked and adored
Flanker, is on a today most bad AIRPLANE! (and with him Su-33, and even
Su-30..) that we see now in Flanker 2, I can call only as delirium. Only do
not speak, is what is it made for realness. What realness, if Su loses a
near combat even A-10A! Well to the on - order..
Is given: Su-27 against A -10A, level for both good, altitude 200m on
head-on courses. For Su - interception, for A-10A - land attack (there is
no for him an interception.) Arms - gun..
The combat last 12 (!) minutes in real time. The planes have made on a
closed loop and have begun turns.. The first shells have got Flanker (truth
without visible damages), then, somewhere on 6 min. Flanker has beaten out
for A -10A one engine. And after began something strange.. They long flied,
and Su behaved not absolutely adequately to situation.. And was finished of
all subjects that A -10A has gone to a tail Su (it with one engine!) and is
accurate him has knocked down. At realization of similar combats with other
planes, Su almost always lost. For F-15C in general never has pulled out a
victory. More - less, Instant - Mig-29 with F-16, and that through times
still can beat. I have viewed set of near combats with miscellaneous types
of airplanes - and for me the sensation has appeared, that the developers
have made the American machines by stronger. I watched of speeds in turns of
both machines, and almost always for Su the speed was less, than for the
American fighters. It what?
Second: behaviour of weapon same strange. It is interesting to watch, as
X-35 beautifully "draws" closed loops and turns above the ships of the
opponent, representing itself the airplane (at altitudes from 500 up to
1000m, is X-35, which on 5ì flies..), and those try it to knock down.


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mbaxter
Member
Member # 191

posted 11-06-1999 08:03 PM     Profile for mbaxter   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message   Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote
Kurt?
Posts: 1687 | From: USA | Registered: Sep 1999  |  IP: Logged
Stinger
Member
Member # 15

posted 11-06-1999 08:33 PM     Profile for Stinger   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message   Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote
Nah, but I think we need a translator nonetheless. :-)

That was heavy!

------------------
Cheers,

Stinger

Owner of the Flanker FBO
http://www.escape.ca/~shepski


Posts: 356 | From: Winnipeg, Manitoba, Canada | Registered: Sep 1999  |  IP: Logged
FalconF1
Member
Member # 11

posted 11-06-1999 08:37 PM     Profile for FalconF1   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message   Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote
L O L, mbaxter!

I hope somebody DOES translate that. Im very confused rite now.


Posts: 300 | From: NY,NY- USA | Registered: Sep 1999  |  IP: Logged
nick moyrand
Member
Member # 214

posted 11-06-1999 09:00 PM     Profile for nick moyrand   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message   Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote
Yeah, I think this is actualy Kurt "plumerinsky's" latest installment, now, can anyone translate?

Thanks.

------------------
Nick Moyrand


Posts: 897 | From: www.lakah-group.com | Registered: Sep 1999  |  IP: Logged
Tory
unregistered

posted 11-06-1999 09:09 PM       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote
I lost him at "Well"
Looks intresting though.

Tory
"FREE TIBET"


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Robbster
Member
Member # 376

posted 11-06-1999 09:33 PM     Profile for Robbster   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message   Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote
It looks as though Kurt Plummer has found a new nick.
Posts: 227 | From: | Registered: Sep 1999  |  IP: Logged
KMHPaladin
Member
Member # 240

posted 11-06-1999 10:56 PM     Profile for KMHPaladin   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message   Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote
You guys all beat me to it... Nick, I think it's time to give up the Anti-Kurt crusade and go after someone else!

------------------
-KMHPaladin
- "The duty of the fighter pilot is to patrol his
area of the sky, and shoot down any enemy
fighters in that area. Anything else is rubbish."
Baron Manfred von Richthofen, 1917
- Harkins3@voicenet.com



Posts: 794 | From: RPI - Troy, NY; originally from South Jersey | Registered: Sep 1999  |  IP: Logged
jgalante
Member
Member # 565

posted 11-06-1999 11:09 PM     Profile for jgalante   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message   Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote
So I WASN'T the only one! Thought it was just getting late.
You guys crack me up!
I do hate to ask, but where is KP re: F2?

"if I wanted to fight, I would have stayed home with my wife"
J. Galante circa 1990


Posts: 62 | From: | Registered: Oct 1999  |  IP: Logged
Lav
Member
Member # 250

posted 11-06-1999 11:47 PM     Profile for Lav   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message   Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote
Yup, I thought it was Kurt after reading (or trying to read) the first sentence, hehehe...

All I can say is... 'Huh?'

I think we need the Rosetta Stone for that one.

Lav

------------------


Posts: 266 | From: San Diego, CA USA | Registered: Sep 1999  |  IP: Logged
mbaxter
Member
Member # 191

posted 11-06-1999 11:58 PM     Profile for mbaxter   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message   Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote
Nah, actually I knew it wasn't Kurt without those irritating / _ * symbols interspersed into every other word. The real KP seems to have gone away...
Posts: 1687 | From: USA | Registered: Sep 1999  |  IP: Logged
Jogn
Member
Member # 777

posted 11-07-1999 12:44 AM     Profile for Jogn   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message   Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote
You should have been a beta tester.
Posts: 20 | From: | Registered: Oct 1999  |  IP: Logged
SLAMMER
unregistered

posted 11-07-1999 05:12 AM       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote
If AI fighters really use the same CAC tactics against different
opponent it is too bad, by the way I think A 10 can't use efficiently its
Avenger cannon againts air target, or am I wrong? It seems to me that
western figters superiority is more obvious in BVR combat thanks to
better avionics but sure in close range Sue would be a very unforgiving
adversary. If AI works this way it should be a primer on SSI patch agenda.

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Johnny
unregistered

posted 11-07-1999 08:17 AM       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote
I have tried the same thing with the A-10 (3vs1). One was destroyed from BVR and I allowed the other 2 to approach me for a knife fight. About a minute later they collided, one was destroyed and the other got his engine damaged. But it didn't affect his performance at all!!! I danced with him until I smashed into the water.

Also A-10's are very accurate with their cannons in head on situation if you don't move he will always gun you down.


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blur
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Member # 781

posted 11-07-1999 09:29 AM     Profile for blur   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message   Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote
me wonder thing of same type. Me in Sue, 8 forces of g...much black out. F15 at all time gaining much lead. I in dirt everytime. Possible, the matter of truth..I suc. But Im getting better. Practice practice practice.
actually I was wondering the same thing. All AI seems incredibly accurate at head on.
And I am all for tough AI but man these guys are GUD!!...hrmmm

[This message has been edited by blur (edited 11-07-1999).]


Posts: 241 | From: New York City | Registered: Oct 1999  |  IP: Logged
Ozias
unregistered

posted 11-07-1999 05:50 PM       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote
I'd imagine it's perfectly possible to use the cannon on the A10 to hit an airtcraft, given:-
a) The Mk1 human eyeball
b) a reasonable amount of skill on the pilot's behalf
c) being real close


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JimG
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Member # 153

posted 11-07-1999 09:02 PM     Profile for JimG   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message   Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote
An A-10 hosed a helo in the Gulf War, but a helo is not a Sue. BTW, ever heard the Avenger in real life? Very loud!
Posts: 1012 | From: Columbia, S.C. | Registered: Sep 1999  |  IP: Logged
EvilBivol-1
Member
Member # 189

posted 11-07-1999 10:48 PM     Profile for EvilBivol-1   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message   Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote
Ehh, that post was taken and horribly translated from Sukhoi.ru forums. Unfortunately, I never got the time to responde to the original poster in Russian, but here goes my take on this...

The AI is (IMO) the most complex of any sim to date. It is bound to have problems and this it does. I hope they address as many of these as possible in patches, but even as it stands, fighting with this AI is a whole new experience. In BVR, my biggest gripe (and really, the most serious gripe I have for the sim) is lack of Notch modeling. Think it was said that they will look into this in the patch.

As for the close in knife fights that he complains about...
First thing I gotta say is, "CHECK YOUR FUEL LOAD!" I noticed that the default fuel setting for the Sue is 100%. Hehehe, you DON'T wanna get into a tangle with a Falcon if your Sue if filled up with the juice. Other then that, I agree that the AI modeling close in has the "overpower" problem. Seems to be carried on from Flanker-1.5. Again, hope they fix it. In the mean time... deal with it! I've had LOADS of fun 'dancing' with the F-15, A-10, and F-16 (both excellent and avrg.). It is different and it is hard, but after a few hours of experimenting with the new flight model, I feel pretty comfy with it.

Lastly, not sure if all the AI use the same techniques. I've noticed that the A-10 goes WAY down low on me, often resulting in my own lawndart. The Eagle tends to stays a bit higher up. Could be the drugs i'm taking though ;-)

Lates


Posts: 188 | From: LA, CA, USA | Registered: Sep 1999  |  IP: Logged
PhantomDave
Member
Member # 208

posted 11-08-1999 01:46 AM     Profile for PhantomDave   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message   Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote
Damn truth EB, I was fighting some time ago against F-14 and I was unable to get to him closer. You know we're fighting quite similar way and after some time we always found a way how to do it... ;-) After many tries I tried to dump fuel in the air...hehe, holding L key whole the dogfight and I started to gain some E over him, finished in NICE position at his tail, sent him to fireball without any problem....As it's maybe cheating to change that in editor ( ;-)) you're engaged in the air, not at the base [gg], it could be quite good to manage your fuel that way ;-)

BUT: I found some problem which has to do with overpowered AI I think....watching his speed and alt when turning with him (F-14), I found he's accelerating when going up and SLOWING when he's going down...strange...and the G load looks similar at both direction...

[This message has been edited by PhantomDave (edited 11-08-1999).]


Posts: 54 | From: Brno, Czech republic | Registered: Sep 1999  |  IP: Logged
sVoloch
unregistered

posted 11-08-1999 02:35 AM       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote
EvilBivol-1, You are a genius to be able to decode that SCHTIRLES talk.
I still don't get it.
Mishka


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Bossman
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Member # 483

posted 11-08-1999 08:08 AM     Profile for Bossman   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message   Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote
Note to all english speaking forum members: Before laughing and bitching that you cannot read some of these posts, go to a russian board and post your comments in thier language.

Thats all folks..

Bossman


Posts: 48 | From: | Registered: Oct 1999  |  IP: Logged
Johnny
unregistered

posted 11-08-1999 09:44 AM       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote
EvilBivol-1,
You think I didn't try that?!? I dumped almost all of the fuel, droped all of the weapons it helped only a little bit. And later on when I was able to get in the tail of that damn A-10 and guess what, we were making descending loops (I guess you can call it horizontal loops) my speed was decreasing because of maximum angle of attack (according to Nadia) and his stayed at 722km/h!!!! Also in another round I managed to damage that bastard's engine and he still was able to make LOOPS!!!

Also I tried F1.5 again and in it Su is alot more manouvreable then in F2.0! I fought against F-15 and it was more fun in F1.5 then 2.0 even though F-15 is overpowered in 1.5.
On the PD's website he said that he AI is very bad and he can easly defeat it, I say that he is a total lier. Show me the prove!

On another note for those of us who have Voodoo Banshee. I have Diamond Monster Fusion the graphics on this card were terrible. So what I did was I deleted everything from PCI folder and copyed the Bazar folder in the PCI. After this the textures became very good I could see the reflections in the cockpit and they weren't pixelated. Also I have installed reference drivers from 3dfx and the terrain became very smooth instead of blocky.

Don't take me wrong guys I LOVE Flanker but it is very frustrating chasing after mud mover who can do the same stuff as a fighter.

Carl these bugs, like the overpowered AI and Su's flight model (if it is realy a bug), will they be fixed with the patch? Also is there a view of me after the ejection flying on the parachute?


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arrow
Member
Member # 321

posted 11-08-1999 11:44 AM     Profile for arrow   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message   Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote
Weeell,
maybe it's because I'm really a jerk with Flanker 2, but the only 2 times I beaten the falcon was THANKS to the fact that I had full tanks.

I just continued to go up and down at full speed (more up than down, since for what I know, Falcons have problems in thin air) with FULL AFTERBURNER, then, after some time, the falcon always leave the fight and start to fly stright forward (going home ? bingo fuel ?).

Now the jerk takes his revenge...

Is it cheating ? I don't know.

But it's cool


Posts: 350 | From: | Registered: Sep 1999  |  IP: Logged
Bones
unregistered

posted 11-08-1999 03:54 PM       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote
No offense at all.. but the AI is almost human, and to defeat it you must wait til it makes a mistake. If you don't observe it's mistakes it will observe yours and kill you. Its that simple. The A-10 is hard at first because your used to the 1.5 AI. Think like a real pilot with a grip on physics instead of just trying to get that target in the center of the HUD. It's not like 1.5, where one lone pilot can grease 8 other planes and go home after taking two missile hits and 10 cannon shots. I fought the Exc F-15 and I've only beat him 2 times, it takes a long time, you watch each other until one gets desperate to coax the other on to do something gutsy... and trust me after 10 minutes of a knife fight he'll do something gutsy.
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Mark
unregistered

posted 11-08-1999 05:51 PM       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote
Bossman...GOOD point.
IMHO, the individual getting flamed for being HONEST with his opinion probably thinks we're a buch of Jerks, and he would be right.
Besides, he's correct in his assesment of the FM's. Just go look at the F3 views on YOUR Su-27/33 in a hard turn, and do the same with the AI. You'll see side slip in your aircraft, but you almost NEVER see it it "theirs". This would make a Gargantuan difference in a turning fight. When have you seen the enemy a/c leave the contrails in a turn that YOU leave? They make these really clean turns, but your Sue will slide through a turn.
Maybe the add-on/ patches will advance the AI FM's to give them the same weaknessses we endure.

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MATADOR
Member
Member # 904

posted 11-09-1999 09:01 AM     Profile for MATADOR   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message   Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote
TO THE RUSSIAN TEAM,
I also feel you made a good point with your post. Flew f1.5, not f2 yet,and I appreciate your info and your effort to express it. Don`t worry I find it understandable enough, and I`m not english-speaking.
To the rest, we should like to have russian posters here. In general they are people very technically oriented and with excellent backgrounds. That´s something to value.
Hope we can get F2 in Spain soon ...!

------------------
MATADOR.


Posts: 4 | From: MADRID, SAPIN | Registered: Nov 1999  |  IP: Logged
JA
unregistered

posted 11-10-1999 09:58 PM       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote
I should have replied earlier, but I agree - posts from Russian (and citizens from any territory formerly part of the USSR) forum readers are most welcome! Apart from Flanker 2.0's excellent FM, graphics, etc, the fact that it is devoted to a Sukhoi aircraft is cause for rejoicing among many of us.
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