Not long ago, our Len "Viking1" Hjalmarson was reading a discussion forum on IL2Sturmovik.com where someone had posted a thread advocating that IL-2 was an instant classic. This got him to thinking...what constitutes a classic simulation and does <I>IL-2</I> qualify for such a distinction?

I remember that thread over there, on of the more thought provoking ones. Good observsations
and I cued in on the end where you said...

My guess is that we will see a very effective campaign engine in the next simulation

I would argue that it takes time to become a "classic". More impotantly, it takes other games coming out after it for comparision.

For example, SWOTL is a classic. Why? Because everybody enjoyed it despite obvious flaws. We measure flight sims against it in some way or other when they come out.

Is every old game a classic? By no means; just those that stick in people's heads. Examples:

Harpoon
Civilization
Reach for the Stars
Master of Orion
War in Russia
Batttles of Napoleon
Warcraft
Kampfgruppe
Wizardry
Myst (!!!!)

Have these games been surpassed? Yes but they are still the benchmarks.

Yes, it looks pretty. Good damage modelling. Interesting AI. Neat aircraft to fly. Avionics suite A+. Did I mention it looks pretty?

Does that make this game a classic? IMHO no. It's a pretty game/sim - lots of neat hidden gems, but the gameplay just isn't there. The campaigns are as exciting to play as it is to watch paint dry.

And flaws on many titles are overwhelmed by other stand out features. The thing is that titles are judged relative to the time. Does Aces Over Europe appeal to anyone now? No. But it did when it was newer, before EAW. It's easy to look back and apply today's logic and values on all things in the past but it's a bankrupt philosophy. I feel many folks do this.

Like you, I anticipate the good things yet to come. Geez, we ran SWOTL in DOS fiddling with expanded and extend memory with a balance to get enough conventional memory available with 512K vid cards and 4-8MB RAM! 4MB of RAM cost about $100 and I just got another 256 for $50! And SWOTL cost $50 new in 1990 and Aces Of The Pacific was about $40+ a couple years later so a similar title today for $50-60 is actually less expensive.

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With CFS2's broken view system, annoying sound, and vegetable-state AI, even bringing CFS2 up as a possible candidate probably does qualify as as definition #5 of classic:

quote:

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extremely and usually comically apropos: apropos to an extreme degree, usually with a comical or ironic twist (informal)

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I totally agree with Bissers. Classic status is aquired after time.

CFS2 is a classic.......A classic piece of dung.

Fork.

Sorry you don't enjoy it.

I actually enjoy the campaigns. By what I read on the forums, I must be one of the only people that do!

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"Thingmies? We don't need no stinking Thingmies"

Personally, SDOE was a lame game until all the community add-on patches really put life into a so-so product.

Sorry for the late reply, yes STURMOVIK TECHNIKA seems to be the best site for IL-2.

You could also try Flugzeugwerk

Sturmovik.com

CPT FARRELS

csThor

And of course The Official IL-2 site

All thse ooze goodness for IL-2. Look out for a campaign by a geezer called OSSI Top notch.

Good luck,

Bilko

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"Thingmies? We don't need no stinking Thingmies"

Is it an 'instant classic' ? No.

Z

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